What is Magic?

[hermi-nomi]

This detracts from the topic a little, but wouldn't explaining how magic can exist in a given world detract from it existing in a given world? The only way I can see an explanation of magic in a story working is if the story revolves around the iontroduction of magic into a world (There is a book I've heard of where the premise is exactly that ~ does anyone know what I'm talking about?)

[GrownUp]

Originally Posted by hermi-nomi

This detracts from the topic a little, but wouldn't explaining how magic can exist in a given world detract from it existing in a given world? The only way I can see an explanation of magic in a story working is if the story revolves around the iontroduction of magic into a world (There is a book I've heard of where the premise is exactly that ~ does anyone know what I'm talking about?)

I don't know if it's exactly what you mean, but in Garth Nix's Abhorsen series there are two worlds which border each other, and at the edges magic still works a little way into a generally non-magical world and technology works a little way into the other, magical, world; a little way and no further.

[Aes]

To me as a person in the real world, "magic" is any unknown phenomenon that cannot be explained by conventional scientific means. Throughout the ages, man has attributed things that he cannot fully understand himself as something either magical or spiritual in nature, and they remain so until they are proven otherwise by scientific means. Even then, that isn't always good enough for some people...

However, for the purposes of a story, "magic" is whatever the writer wants it to be, simple as that.

Originally Posted by hermi-nomi

This detracts from the topic a little, but wouldn't explaining how magic can exist in a given world detract from it existing in a given world? The only way I can see an explanation of magic in a story working is if the story revolves around the iontroduction of magic into a world (There is a book I've heard of where the premise is exactly that ~ does anyone know what I'm talking about?)

Not necessarily. In one story (anime, actually, and if I've followed it correctly) 'magic' is actually the result of a glitch and manipulating aspects of the artificially-created enviornment that the story takes place in. Explaining it like that actually adds to the story, if you think about it.

[pyan]

Clarke's Third Law:

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Conversely:

Elliott's First Law

"Any sufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology."

If you can't work out how it was done, it's probably magic. If you can, and you can reproduce it, it's probably science.

[Soraya]

thats a pretty good explanation. Saturday i'm going to a magic show, some international ppl called the Pendragons. i realized i should go because i have become so cynical and the world today is so blatantly realistic and hard, we rely mostly on science, that a bit of magic and lore might be welcome.

[Jives]

Originally Posted by pyanfaruk

Clarke's Third Law:

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

That's the quote that came to my mind when I read this thread. it reminds me of the personal force fields in the "Foundation" series and the reaction to them that the lesser-developed worlds had.

But then again, I have some experience with things that I'll share at a later date that can't be defined by science. And believe me, I'm a mathematician and I have an extensive science background and if I can't explain them...

They must be magic.

What about when the phone rings and you already know who it is...is that magic?

Or how about when you are humming a tune and you turn on the radio and the song is on it...at the exact place you were in the song. Is that magic?

[An8el]

I liked Teresa's comprehensive definition above.

I'm noticing how using an explanation of "magic" as a reason for something is a wish or hope for mystery - or a positive explanation for something you would like to happen again and again and perhaps gain the power to evoke at will.

I was relating a story about an owl who pulled hairs from my head while hovering three feet above me to a scientist friend while hiking. After the story and pretty much on cue, just ahead flies this huge owl just past us, quite close. My scientist friend says to me, "You're really a witch, aren't you?"

Ever notice how, when people do not have an explanation for something or someone's motives, people tend to assign the worst explanation? I'm not sure why this is, but it's very common.
It seems that magic is the other, more positive explanation to that which can't be explained, or for some people even imagined.

[Sharukem]

magic yes is very hard to describe. But in many other books magic is always something new. but in reality magic is meant for good and to help out others and mother nature but people tend to use it for bad by harmong others, mother nature and anything else you can think of.

[Nesacat]

Magic for me is a place where dreams and the imagination thrive. It offers inspiration to humanity and gives us a word to call all that which cannot be explained, is marvelous and fills us with a sense of wonder at the vast creativity of the universe. It is perhaps a state of mind or being. Maybe even a way of life.

[Talysia]

I've read a lot of Masamune Shirow's work, (mostly graphic novels) and some of the stories he creates put forth the idea that science is the new black magic. In the future, maybe it will be possible to create people with powers that could be classed as magic, even though they would be made using science. I don't think even that could be classed as true magic, though, despite its appearance.
Personally speaking, I don't think magic should be explained. There are lots of things that could be considered as magic, some subtle, and some strong, depending on your definition, but I'd like to think that there should always be something in the universe that cannot be explained.

[Saltheart]

Magic, to me, is a precursor to protoscience. It is assigned to what men do not understand, and they try to study natural philosophy to understand how to manipulate and understand the natural world. It is a precursor to Alchemy and Natural Philosophy.

Saaltaei, are you trying to say that beauty is magic?

[The Pelagic Argosy]

Having just come off the "Is fantasy really sci fi" thread...

Maybe, once you explain how the "magic" in your story works, you have officially written a science fiction story, rather than a fantasy story.

So, if you want to write a fantasy story, you deliberately leave the explanation out because you want to retain that sense of mystery and power for your readers that feels "magical" and is one of the pleasures of choosing fantasy over science fiction. (Or maybe you left out the explanation because you don't want to bother with one.)