Wolf or Lion? Dragon or Stag?

[Aegon the Unworthy]

Wha what? Do I need to start the Stannis Baratheon Anti-Defamation Lea...err Cadre? The SBADC...and I would run ads saying...

Stannis; Maybe yer other choices for monarch suck more?
and

Stannis Baratheon; Putting the Dic in Dictator for the last 40 years.

and

Stannis; His wife may be ugly, but shes not sleeping with her brother. Just the court jester.

See, he's more respected already.

[TK-421]

Ha!

How about:

Stannis, bitterness is a hard pill to swallow.

or

Stannis of House Baratheon; if foreign Gods and flaming hearts are your thing, look no further.

or

Stannis, everyone loves a woman in red. Especially when she's the controlling the king.

But, seriously, Dave and Aegon, we've had this debate before I believe and like stale mouldy bread, nobody would proudly wear an I Love Stannis button.

[Aegon the Unworthy]

And I say unto you....PISH!

As Weasel said in a different thread, we cant let the board go 24 hours without a meaningful post....well why not rehash the Stannis debate. Admittedly to be a debate there has to be two sides.....On one side theres Stannis sucks, and other side....Stannis blows.....

So feel free to discuss at length whether Stannis sucks or blows....

[Dave289]

Heh.

I like the one about 'your other choices sucking more'.

And besides, Stannis never wanted to be loved, or even liked...

Just King. And hell, he didn't even really 'want' that. Or am I wrong?





Dave

[TK-421]

Oh yes, he "wanted" that! He especially "wanted" that, which he so eloquently put it to his dear brother before he killed him. But Stannis will get what's coming to him. I see Melissandre as his likely killer but Jon could do him in as well.

And, to quote a classic Mel Brooks movie: "She's gone from suck to blow!"

[Aegon the Unworthy]

My prediction on Stannis is as follows....Ive uttered this before but theres new people around now....

1) He recently moved his command into the Nightfort, thats the equivalent of hanging out a sign "Demonic Possession Desired--Inquire Within".....

2) Melissandre claims he is Azor Ahai reborn. To that end she has practiced "blood" magic and given him a flaming sword that doesnt actually flame. Lady M lies, she is a wierd kind of evil. She is the evil that comes when someone is militantly religious and devout. She is attempting to bring forth whatever nameless entity that leads the others so she can destroy it. She believes Stannis is the instrument that will help her.

3) Stannis had the most appropriate response to the Wildlings coming. Instead of looking for loyalty from the North in return for aid (ala Tywin and his let them overrun the wall policy, then the northman will have to deal with them). You defend the kingdom so you can rule it, you dont rule the kingdom so you can defend it.

4) Stannis is going to be possessed and killed by Jon. In the end it will be his brittleness and sense of honor that doom him and his possessor, so in a sense it will be Stannis who defeats the other, not Jon and not Melisandre (whom he eats alive or something sufficiently gruesome)

There ya go, now you dont even have to read the next couple of books....

[Dave289]

TK:

I'm very probably wrong about whether or not Stannis 'wanted' the Iron Throne. Sadly, I lost all my ASOIAF books in a recent move, and it's been a long while since I read the first 3. (Finances at the moment do not permit re-purchasing the series..sigh.)

Still, personally, I'd rather see Stannis on the throne (minus his pocket witch) than Dany and whatever wierd menagerie of supporters she can cobble together.



Just my opinion

Dave

[Weasel Soup]

Dear brotherhood of the proper name Dave,

In the prologue of ACOK Stannis doesnt just mention what he feels as his birthright to the throne he also refers to his brother (Renly) as an usurper. Unwilling wouldnt be the case. Additionally this is the point in ASOIAF where he converts to Melisandre's way of thinking.

(At the stern approval (ahem) of his bat eared wife.)

Mel basically kills his childhood maester in the prologue too.

Edit : Aegon I think Renly both sucks and blows so Stannis must be a vaccuum.

[Dave289]

Right, right. I never meant to imply that he was 'unwilling'. Just that he may have viewed it as more of a 'right' and a 'duty' rather than a desire. Splitting hairs, I know.
As we all know, that kooky Stannis is pretty hardline when it comes to questions of 'right' and 'duty'..even before the Red Woman popped up.

Again, it's been a long while. So basically I'm just talking to be talking because I enjoy hearing all of you fine Westerosi scholars' viewpoints. This forum is my very first stop after my homepage loads every day now.


As always, just my rambling opinion.

Dave

[Funky Cthulu]

Originally Posted by Dave289

TK:

I'm very probably wrong about whether or not Stannis 'wanted' the Iron Throne. Sadly, I lost all my ASOIAF books in a recent move, and it's been a long while since I read the first 3. (Finances at the moment do not permit re-purchasing the series..sigh.)

Dave

Hi Dave,
You're not wrong as such, but there was a gap between what Stannis said and his actions. I recall he did say for a while that he was pursuing the crown out of 'duty', and that he took no joy in killing Renly. So he did (does) want the crown, but denied having nefarious personal reasons, instead claiming it was all in the service of duty and order, etc.
A sort of "This is hurting me more than it hurts you" style of thinking.

[Dave289]

Exactly, Your Tentacledness. That was the exact hair I was looking to split; I'm glad your razor is sharper than mine.






Regards
Dave

[TK-421]

Originally Posted by Dave289

TK:

Sadly, I lost all my ASOIAF books in a recent move, and it's been a long while since I read the first 3. (Finances at the moment do not permit re-purchasing the series..sigh.)

Holly sh*$!!!!!!!! Is there something we can do? How about putting a can at the next geek convention with your picture on it for people to drop in loose change. We can also set up an account at a bank to accept donations. I mean if everyone on this forum donated $1 towards your purchase of even a used series of books, that would be a great act in helping a fellow human being. I can see us all reaching Nirvana now...

If not, borrow someone else's and just use the photocopier at work...oh wait, that would be called breaking copyright laws...please don't tell GRRM

[Culhwch]

Originally Posted by TK-421

If not, borrow someone else's and just use the photocopier at work...oh wait, that would be called breaking copyright laws...please don't tell GRRM

Not to mention, he'd be there until aDwD comes out.

[Funky Cthulu]

Originally Posted by Dave289

Exactly, Your Tentacledness. That was the exact hair I was looking to split; I'm glad your razor is sharper than mine.


Regards
Dave

Once you're on your third read of the books, it will be all old hat
I often wonder how GRRM goes about writing in all the detail (and thus creating all these details for us to mull over) - is it all just present in his head, or does he draw big flow charts and pin them up, or has he created the structure beforehand and then written the characters to fit?

[Dave289]

Well, I probably have read all of them three times, it's just been ages on the first 3..and..and..*sniffs*..I can't re-read those first three at the moment.

*sobs, sniffles, and holds out the can*


Love

Dave