POV Issues in the First Chronicles

[Locksmith]

I've almost finished reading the First Chronicles trilogy and one thing that struck me was the gradual deterioration in the point of view from which the stories are told. Unfortunately, for me this undermined the whole premise of the first book (that Covenant does not believe the world is real), which made the book interesting and different.

In the first book, we only ever see the story from the POV of Covenant. This is consistent with the fact that we have no idea whether the other characters exist outside Covenant's imagination. By the end of the book, when he ends up back home, you still aren't sure whether the Land was real or not.

In the second book, Donaldson clearly wanted to split his party into two, with Troy in one party and Covenant in the other. This means that he is forced to give us a second POV, that of Troy, which affirms Troy's existence. By the third book, Donaldson has abandoned any pretence that the land might be imaginary and we get told the story from a large number of POV. Near the end of the third book, Donaldson seems to remember that the land may be imaginary (which is where I'm now up to, about 100 pages from the end).

What attracted me to the books in the first place was the idea that the Land may be imaginary or real, you just don't know. This POV problem spoiled things a little, though in honesty I never really felt that Donaldson made enough out of the possible non-existence of the Land for my liking.

[Foxbat]

I tend to agree with you that, as the tale progressed, The Land became more and more real....and this is exactly the reason why a chapter was dropped from The Illearth War. It was felt that inclusion of this section would give The Land too much of a footing in the 'real' world. It was later released on its own as Gilden Fire.

I suppose it must be a problem for writers of works which cover so much to limit the point of view without degrading the storyline. I presume it's all a question of balance (which you obviously felt was not completely reached).

[nixie]

Gilden fire...I haven't heard of this is it published as a novel in its own right? or is it a short story?

[littlemissattitude]

I believe it is a short story, nixie.

As to point of view - it's been a long time since I read the first trilogy (or the second, for that matter), but I seem to recall noticing that the POV changed, but that it didn't bother me all that much. I guess I was just so much into the story (I read both trilogies, one book after another, in probably less than a month) that I wasn't paying that much attention to the logical niceties.

[nixie]

I done that last year...got so hooked on the Land that I'd read all 6 books in about 3 weeks...Picked up in The Runes but read there was going to be an average 2 year gap between each book I've forced myself not to read it.
I also noticed the change in POV but it didn't spoil my enjoyment.

[Rahl Windsong]

Well I probly screwed ip on this series cause I saw Runes of Earth at a book store and it looked real good so I bought it and read it. Now I guess I have to read the stuff before it. Runes was a very enjoyable story!

Rahl

[Foxbat]

Gilden fire...I haven't heard of this is it published as a novel in its own right? or is it a short story?

Gilden Fire was published in hardback a few years ago. It's around 100 pages long and has a foreword explaining that it is a chapter dropped from The Illearth War. So, in a sense, it's more of an extract from a novel but it reads like a short story (it tells the tale of the Bloodguard who go to Seareach to ask the giants for help).

[nixie]

Thanks Foxbat,have managed to get a copy from Amazon,well order one

[GOLLUM]

Read Gilden Fire and enjoyed it....

[Locksmith]

Finished the First Chronicles last night. I really enjoyed the last 150 pages or so, but I must confess I found much of the rest of the book a bit of a struggle. I think it was a combination of the over-florid language (seriously, how much gloaming went on in the land?!) and the character of TC himself.

Is there much different in the second Chronicles, or would I be equally frustrated? My current thinking is that life is too short, and there are too many other books to be read...

[HieroGlyph]

PoV...
Well, its also a long time since I read these. And I dont read fast so I hardly noticed or specifically remember any particular changes, but I dont recall the PoV's being contradictory. Covenant himself for a long time refused to believe in the Land. Troy, we soon realise, was of 'our' world too and too complex and rather different to be one of Covenants creations. I think Donaldson as a writer allowed us to take the Land for granted at any point beyond the first book. He wasnt, imo, trying to make us play guessing games all the way through the Chronicles. He's still a darn fine writer. And its still a gripping and wondrous tale. Maybe the originator of this thread has spotted a slight hole in Donaldsons intent. Maybe he's (or she, sorry) is looking 'too' deeply into the way the story is relayed. But you have to know, I guess, that my view is tainted by several readings of the whole series. Its quite difficult for me to percieve the story anew from beginning to end and guess how someone fresh to this could view it!
(I think I just blew away my ability to even comment upon this thread - *sound of chuckles as some man in rags disappears around the corner*) [Spellings...]

[Locksmith]

As you may have guessed from my posts above, I didn't particularly engage with the book, which may be the reason why I was more critical of the narrative in reading it than those who found themselves immersed.

[HieroGlyph]

Originally Posted by Locksmith

...for me this undermined the whole premise of the first book (that Covenant does not believe the world is real), which made the book interesting and different...

Aye, some of us are/were engrossed in it. Its all make-believe, so its then an interaction between you and the author. You found the story kind of undermined (my added words) and yet interesting and different. Cause for mention. Cause and more ... effect

I think its all about attaining that enjoyment without being let down too often. And no-one else can say what will or wont let you down...

[Allanon]

i thought it was great and was so caught up in the books that i didnt even think about critisising it. i may have to read it again but for me as it stands i couldnt pick fault.

[Blind Prophet]

Originally Posted by Locksmith

I've almost finished reading the First Chronicles trilogy and one thing that struck me was the gradual deterioration in the point of view from which the stories are told. Unfortunately, for me this undermined the whole premise of the first book (that Covenant does not believe the world is real), which made the book interesting and different.

In the first book, we only ever see the story from the POV of Covenant. This is consistent with the fact that we have no idea whether the other characters exist outside Covenant's imagination. By the end of the book, when he ends up back home, you still aren't sure whether the Land was real or not.

In the second book, Donaldson clearly wanted to split his party into two, with Troy in one party and Covenant in the other. This means that he is forced to give us a second POV, that of Troy, which affirms Troy's existence. By the third book, Donaldson has abandoned any pretence that the land might be imaginary and we get told the story from a large number of POV. Near the end of the third book, Donaldson seems to remember that the land may be imaginary (which is where I'm now up to, about 100 pages from the end).

What attracted me to the books in the first place was the idea that the Land may be imaginary or real, you just don't know. This POV problem spoiled things a little, though in honesty I never really felt that Donaldson made enough out of the possible non-existence of the Land for my liking.

While i must say you are right, think of this:

Would the story work if it was only told through Covenant's POV?

And as for showing the world through Troy's POV affirming his existance, In the power that preserves, we see the story through the POV's or Mhoram and Triock, yet that does not prove that they exist. I think at this point in the series we need to draw our own conclusions to the existance of the Land, more could be revealed later (I'm currently at the point you were when you wrote that post) and my dad (when telling me of the books before i read them) that someone may (he couldn't remeber) come to the "real" world from the Land, I don't know