Trivia - PLEASE ALWAYS READ FIRST POST!

[Marky Lazer]

I'm not sure, doing this without any reference, but I believe Melkor changed his shape into a bat.

[GOLLUM]

Originally Posted by Marky Lazer

I'm not sure, doing this without any reference, but I believe Melkor changed his shape into a bat.

Nope sorry, but my second clue after christmas day will hone it down significantly and the final clue will point to the
source, so there's a decent chance one of you will get it...

[HieroGlyph]

Sauron had bat, wolf, snake... and others too. But I cant recall Melkor ever being of a mind to lose his 'superior' view of himself and be anything but the mountainous humanoid in which he first took shape when he came to reside upon Arda (Arda being Manwe's name for Earth?).

[Raynor]

Hm, are you sure is the answer found in the "acceptable" sources of this trivia? I didn't find it in the letters, and in in the Sil, it is only said:

Originally Posted by Of the begining of days

So came Tulkas the Strong, whose anger passes like a mighty wind, scattering cloud and darkness before it; and Melkor fled before his wrath and his laughter, and forsook Arda, and there was peace for a long age

Then again, I might have to look more attentively

[Teresa Edgerton]

Raynor, maybe before the next question is asked we will need a clarification on which published version(s) of the Silmarillion would be an acceptable source.

And if you were referring in the rules only to the Christopher Tolkien/Guy Kay redaction that first saw print, did you mean to include the entire volume -- the Ainulindalë, Valaquenta, Akallabêth, etc. -- or merely the Quenta Silmarillion?

But for the moment, so that we can get the question answered and move on, I'm going to rule that anything ever published under that title is fair game for this question only.

Henceforth, however, it will mean only whatever you intended it to mean in the original post (as soon as we all reach an understanding on that point).

[Raynor]

Raynor, maybe before the next question is asked we will need a clarification on which published version(s) of the Silmarillion would be an acceptable source.

I propose the 1977 edition (it starts with "The Silmarillion, now published four years after the death of its author" i.e. 1973).

...did you mean to include the entire volume -- the Ainulindalë, Valaquenta, Akallabêth, etc. -- or merely the Quenta Silmarillion?

Yes.

[GOLLUM]

Well I wasn't going to provide this final clue until after Christmas, Merry Chritsmas btw it's already mornnig on Dec 25 here...

However as it's causing some apparent confusion my source is indeed from the Simlarillion. I have the entire volume incl. the Ainulindalë, Valaquenta, Akallabêth plus the Quenta Silmarillion as Kelpie alludes to and it also has the forward Raynor mentions.

Basically my source is the Quenta Silmarillion.

Apologies to those in Europe or elsewhere who may not have the advantage of witnessing this post ahead of our American friends but I felt obliged to clarify the point. Still if you hurry or are still up you might still pip them at the post...

This will be my final clue, my lips are now sealed until I'm next able to post by the earliest tommorow to confirm replies or otherwise.

Gotta rush and get ready for the celebrations and then comes the presents, hope I get a book or two..

[Teresa Edgerton]

I found the reference, I believe, but if so the original phrasing of the question (in particular "their newfound ally Tulkas") strikes me as inaccurate and misleading. So I think I have to ask you to either PM me the page number and show me that I've got the wrong one, or else revise the question so that it more truly represents the actual time-frame.

[Teresa Edgerton]

OK everyone, Gollum and I have exchanged PMs, and I think we are in agreement that the question needs to be restated, a little more clearly this time.

[GOLLUM]

Yes, I should've stated or indicated that Tulkas had already well and truly become involved with the other Valar when this specific event I'm referring to in the Quenta Silmarillion took place.

In other words by way of another clue look deeper or further along the timeline or story in the Quenta Silmarillion for the solution.

In Tolkien's world Melkor, after a protracted conflict with the Valar, manages to evade capture from their established ally Tulkas before "seemingly" dissapearing from Arda for a period of time.

My question is how exactly did Melkor manage to avoid capture from Tulkas?

I hope this clarifies things a little better and apologies for any confusion....

[Raynor]

He "hid himself and passed from place to place as a cloud on the hills"?

[GOLLUM]

Originally Posted by Raynor

He "hid himself and passed from place to place as a cloud on the hills"?

Yes you're correct Raynor. Your turn....

Here's the original extract everyone from Chapter 7 Of the Silmarils and the Unrest of the Noldor in the Quenta Silmarillion :

Now Melkor, knowing that his devices had been revealed, hid himself and passed from place to place as a cloud on the hills and Tulkas as sought for him in vain. Then it seemed to the people of Valinor that the light of the Trees was dimmed, and the shadows of all standing things grew longer and darker in that time. It is told that for a time Melkor was not seen again in Valinor, nor was any rumour heard of him.

Just one query will Quenta Silmarillion now be the only source used when dealing with The Silmiraillion other than LOTR or the letters of course??...

[Teresa Edgerton]

As I now understand him, Raynor meant everything in that first book published after Tolkien's death, the one with the title The Silmarillion on the cover. But nothing (except the Letters) published after that point.

It seems fair, in that it allows members who don't have an extensive Tolkien library at their fingertips to participate on an equal footing with those who do.

[Raynor]

How was the game of golf invented?
(I am completely observing the rules!)

Just one query will Quenta Silmarillion now be the only source used when dealing with The Silmiraillion other than LOTR or the letters of course??.

I appologise for my silly previous reply to this question; the whole of the Silmarillion (1977 edition) can be used.

[Raynor]

To make matters more precise, the answer is found in the Hobbit...
(too bad posts can't be edited)