describing my star system - about 200 words.

[springs]

Apparently my nearly pathological fear of info dumping has left me in the position that my world building lacks detail. Anyway, this is an attempt to describe my star system without a. sending anyone to sleep and b. making it at least half way possible. (my apologies if i have mucked up some excellent technical advice I was given...)

So my questions are: can you visualise this twin system? Can you see how the political links for the three zones work and how this translates to the geography - astrography? is that a word - described? If not, could you bear another 50 words. And for the techies - will it work. (I have 21 named planets or satellites in it, some are terraformed, there's probably about 40 in total.)

Oh, and is there a better word for swiped, it's driving me mad.... the POV character is General Allen (Allen is his surname)


He took his place at the head of the table and looked at each of the others in turn. They returned his gaze, their full attention on him. Satisfied, he swiped his hand over the desk. A screen formed across the centre of the room, filling it and visible from all angles. It showed the twin star systems governed by the Pettina Empire.

The twelve central planets, each of those a seat of power for the Great Families lay at the cusp of where the planetary discs of each sun crossed. Around them, their satellites and nearest planetary clusters formed the mid-zone planets, dependent on and tied to an individual Great Family. Further out, scattered along the fringes of both systems, lay the outer zone planets. Hostile, life-limited, often terraformed, they had been colonised purely to extract any mineral wealth they held. Some were coloured to show the links to a Great Family, some shaded green indicating they were part of the Pettina empire. Most were red: in rebellion, struggling to hold their independence and aligned to the rebels.

The General looked around the table once more, and the room quietened, ready for him to begin. The chart zoomed in to a single planet, one close to Abendau and linked to the planet and the Pettina’s.

“With reference to the recent breach of security on Dignad - ”

[Gary Compton]

Sounds great to me Springs. I think sometimes critiquers here focus too much on telling.

You are describing what he's seeing so it's in POV, you could maybe break it up a little with dialogue.

John Jarrold once corrected me when I thought something was an info dump. He said, 'He's seeing it so it's not an info dump.'

Originally Posted by springs1971

Apparently my nearly pathological fear of info dumping has left me in the position that my world building lacks detail. Anyway, this is an attempt to describe my star system without a. sending anyone to sleep and b. making it at least half way possible. (my apologies if i have mucked up some excellent technical advice I was given...)

So my questions are: can you visualise this twin system? Can you see how the political links for the three zones work and how this translates to the geography - astrography? is that a word - described? If not, could you bear another 50 words. And for the techies - will it work. (I have 21 named planets or satellites in it, some are terraformed, there's probably about 40 in total.)

Oh, and is there a better word for swiped, it's driving me mad.... the POV character is General Allen (Allen is his surname)


He took his place at the head of the table and looked at each of the others in turn. They returned his gaze, their full attention on him.

'Is every body ready,' he asked.

Yes your greatness,' they replied

Satisfied, he moved his hand over the desk. A gesture that formed a screen across the centre of the room, filling it and visible from all angles.

Everybody smiled in awe at what they were seeing. The three dimensional map showed the twin star systems governed by the Pettina Empire.

Their leader pointed to the twelve central planets, each of those a seat of power for the Great Families lay at the cusp of where the planetary discs of each sun crossed.

'This is our world blah de blah de blah.' (or your words.)

Around them, their satellites and nearest planetary clusters formed the mid-zone planets, dependent on and tied to an individual Great Family. Further out, scattered along the fringes of both systems, lay the outer zone planets. Hostile, life-limited, often terraformed, they had been colonised purely to extract any mineral wealth they held. Some were coloured to show the links to a Great Family, some shaded green indicating they were part of the Pettina empire. Most were red: in rebellion, struggling to hold their independence and aligned to the rebels.

The General looked around the table once more, and the room quietened, ready for him to begin. The chart zoomed in to a single planet, one close to Abendau and linked to the planet and the Pettina’s.

“With reference to the recent breach of security on Dignad - ”

[HareBrain]

I think I misunderstood this as I got horribly confused.

Originally Posted by springs1971

He took his place at the head of the table and looked at each of the others in turn. They returned his gaze, their full attention on him. Satisfied, he swiped his hand over the desk. [passed his palm over the desk?] A screen formed across the centre of the room, filling it and visible from all angles. It showed the twin star systems governed by the Pettina Empire.

The twelve central planets, each of those a seat of power for the Great Families lay at the cusp of where the planetary discs of each sun crossed. [you mean like the middle bit in a Venn diagram? Does this mean they stay in that crossover zone rather than orbit their sun? If so, then these planets are farthest from the suns?] Around them [around the 12 central planets?], their satellites and nearest planetary clusters formed the mid-zone planets [so these would be closer to each sun than the central planets?], dependent on and tied to an individual Great Family. Further out [OK, now I'm confused. If the central planets were in the crossover zone and thus at extreme range from their own suns, how can these be farther out?], scattered along the fringes of both systems, lay the outer zone planets. Hostile, life-limited, often terraformed, they had been colonised purely to extract any mineral wealth they held. Some were coloured to show the links to a Great Family, some shaded green indicating they were part of the Pettina empire. Most were red: in rebellion, struggling to hold their independence and aligned to the rebels.

The General looked around the table once more, and the room quietened, ready for him to begin. The chart zoomed in to a single planet, one close to Abendau and linked to the planet and the Pettina’s.

“With reference to the recent breach of security on Dignad - ”

[springs]

Now I'm scratching my head, too... so i have two stars, each with their own solar system. Their planetary orbits are seperate but they have a sector where they come close (without interfering in the other system), and it's this sector where the 12 main planets are. They need to be in the Goldilocks zone for one or other system. Logically I had in mind that they were part of a single system, otherwise they're going to vary wildly in terms of timescale etc. (techie question, if there are two suns does this increase the parameters for a goldilocks zone? Just wondering)

So they are not neccesarily further out than the outer planets, dependant on orbit. The cross over zone is what is - politically - the centre of the empire where the 12 planets are.

I might be better going with a different system - and I'm pretty happy to, I'm not wedded to this one - but it needs to sustain about 40 planets, which is too much for a single system, I'm told, and probably not enough for a galaxy. I'd be delighted to be wrong, and just call the whole thing a galaxy and have done with it...

I think part of the problem is that the political centre of the empire is not actually the stars themselves, which are the astrographical center(s).

[HareBrain]

I don't understand how the "central planets" can be in this cross-over zone all the time. If each planet is orbiting its own sun, it'll pass through this crossover zone once each year, won't it? (Though I imagine the gravity of the other sun would play havoc with its orbit.)

Are the two planetary discs in the same plane?

[Gary Compton]

I cant help on the planetary thing - only with my editor hat on

**shouts to ball and chain, 'Have I got an editor hat?'**

[springs]

In my understanding, admittedly limited, in a binary system one star would hold the dominant orbit, so I was envisualising the majority of the 12 planets following the dominant star. I can go a couple of ways with this -

I can reduce the number of lead planets and families to about 6/7 which, given this is sci fi and assuming they are able to terraform (I have references to various terraformed planets throughout the series), would allow me to have a central star system within a galaxy and allow the power base to radiate from there. This would bring both into line with each other. I'd have to jiggle some personnel around a bit in the sequel, but it could be done.

It still leaves that some of what's defined politically as the outer zone may have a close in orbit to a star whose system forms part of the galaxy, it's just it wouldn't be the star system the key planet (Abendau) is based in, which would remain the political centre.

I can have a dual power base in each star system, but that becomes really awkward, and much harder to sustain politically.

The only thing I'm wedded to is that Abendau and at least 6 other planets, preferably up to 11 are positioned where they are politically central. It makes sense for this to be central geographically as well - in which case a galaxy with multiple star system might be better.

My proviso is that her empire doesn't stretch across the whole galaxy, just the central zone of it... as 40 planets isn't, I think, enough...

[RJM Corbet]

I really like Gary's take on this, and think it's the best way to do it

[ctg]

Originally Posted by springs1971

So my questions are:

1. can you visualise this twin system?
2. Can you see how the political links for the three zones work and how this translates to the geography - astrography? is that a word - described?
3. If not, could you bear another 50 words.

1. If you mean one star, with a twin solar systems interacting with the central star, the answer is no. It needs a longer or more detailed description.
2. I can see a political system, but not the complexities as that would take far more than couple of hundred words to explain.
3. Easily.

[HareBrain]

I'm still having trouble visualising it. Can you scan a drawing?

I think you'll find life easier with a standard single solar system as the core, and separate solar systems at the empire's fringes, assuming you have FTL travel.

[RJM Corbet]

If 'astrography' wasn't a word yesterday, it is today

I agree with ctg as well: if you're gonna do it, do it.

Incidentally, Springs, I'm finding it a bit difficult to actually visualize. I don't know if that's because, with your allergy to info-dumping, you're not willing to fill in the details, or because you can't quite see a detailed picture of it in your own mind?

Being one of the (armchair) physics buffs around here, I'm battling a bit with the actual layout ...

EDIT: Sorry HB, your post landed while I was typing

[chrispenycate]

Going up from a single system to a galaxy is rather a big leap (about a billionfold); you could try a stellar cluster as an intermediate stage. (there's a galactic arm after that, too)

Even with a binary system you're going to have problems getting forty inhabitable bodies into the goldilocks zone. Consider our solar system; with intensive terraforming, you could probably get Earth, the moon, Mars and Venus inhabitable. A bigger star might, just might, increase this by one, but to get any more you need to start moving some pretty big real estate. A couple of the asteroids might be big enough, plus a few gas giant moons, but moving these into stable orbits is engineering on a scale that makes me blanche; why not build a ringworld while you're about it.

Or, to go completely over the top (what, me?) if your two stars are similar mass (not likely, most binaries looked at are a giant and a dwarf, just a gas giant a bit oversized) they'll be orbiting their mutual centre of gravity (actually, all binary stars will, but in most cases it's inside the photosphere of the larger star). Now, if we move the stars about until the centre is in the Goldilocked zone, we can arrange our twelve major planets in a double Klemperer rosette around the c of g, not orbiting the stars at all. However, I don't see any way this could come about spontaneously, particularly when I'm intending to put the stars' ecliptics orthogonal to the line between them, so the outer planets are in 'ordinary' orbits round their respective primaries. If ever you find the race who can do cosmic engineering on this scale, have I got a job for them!

Wouldn't be long term stable, but a million years or so, shouldn't get too shaky. Better with a single rosette of six planets.

Otherwise, you could give up planets entirely, except as anchors, and build huge, spinning space stations where the environment can be controlled so your Goldilocksage is no longer critical. Or move the asteroid belt into the Goldizone, accepting these aren't really classifiable as planets, and dome them and have the bulk of your population in microgravity. Or have a 'superjupiter' gas giant planet in the right place, with a whole family of planet-sized moons all about the same distance from their star, if differently spaced round their planet. If you've got "Number of the Beast" technology, collect planets from around thirty different stars, and put them all in the same ball of string orbit round one star (start of a Dyson swarm) (I'll give you a hundred thousand year stability on this one, no more; not enough to evolve intelligence, but stable enough to colonise).

[RJM Corbet]

Originally Posted by chrispenycate

... Or have a 'superjupiter' gas giant planet in the right place, with a whole family of planet-sized moons all about the same distance from their star ...

Yeah, that's it ...

[ctg]

I don't have any problem on following the narrative, but I have a problem on visualising the system. What I also see is that you have an excellent opportunity to go off and write several thousand words of exposive narrative, that details not only the system, but also its political and militaristic objectives. If the general is one of the main POV's then stick with him all the way through and don't be afraid on making heavy narrative paras between the dialogue lines.

This is how they visualised BSG system:

http://www.fanboy.com/wp-content/upl...colonies_1.jpg (note: it's really large.)

And this gives a visualisation to a small star cluster:

[springs]

Okay, so the system I've outlined isn't working. (I'm happy to fall on my sword on that one. I apparently love a nice rewrite....)

Stellar cluster sounds closest and I quite like the term... plus I understand that, once we get onto dwarfs (of any colour) and giants, I'm like Warren Buffet, I don't invest in that I don't understand...

So a stellar cluster with a central star which has 7 lead planets. Several smaller solar systems with planets (goldilock ones included) and terriformed - say 8 systems, the 3 closest to the central one form the mid zone, the other 4, towards the outer extremity of the cluster the outer zone? Clearer?

Chrispy, what about some nice strings dangled down from heaven, if I jiggled it a bit?

@RJM: probably. My scientific terminology is nearly legendary for its, um, non-existence.

@Gary, I will use your approach to break it up a bit, ty.

and at everyone, thanks so much for the time. And the diagram, CTG, that really helps.