F1: 2011 - (caution - may contain result spoilers just after a race...)

[pyan]

Originally Posted by thaddeus6th

Sauber are appealing. Given they derived no advantage from a technical irregularity, a grid penalty for Malaysia would seem fairer.

The infringement was against these two rules:

*Article 3.10.1
"Any bodywork more than 150mm behind the rear wheel centre line which is between 150mm and 730mm above the reference plane, and between 75mm and 355mm from the car centre line, must lie in an area when viewed from the side of the car that is situated between 150mm and 350mm behind the rear wheel centre line and between 300mm and 400mm above the reference plane. When viewed from the side of the car no longitudinal cross section may have more than one section in this area.
"Furthermore, no part of this section in contact with the external air stream may have a local concave radius of curvature smaller than 100mm.
"Once this section is defined, 'gurney' type trim tabs may be fitted to the trailing edge. When measured in any longitudinal cross section no dimension of any such trim tab may exceed 20mm."

** Article 3.10.2
"Other than the bodywork defined in Article 3.10.9, any bodywork behind a point lying 50mm forward of the rear wheel centre line which is more than 730mm above the reference plane, and less than 355mm from the car centre line, must lie in an area when viewed from the side of the car that is situated between the rear wheel centre line and a point 350mm behind it."

If that's the sort of reg the designers have to work to, I'm amazed a completely legal car ever gets built...

[Foxbat]

It appears that Sauber have withdrawn their appeal. It will be interesting to see how they manage the tyres for the rest of the season (if they gained any advantage from the rear wing anomaly).

Meanwhile, Paul di Resta is confirmed tenth and gets his first point in his first race

[thaddeus6th]

Good for di Resta, but it's pretty unfortunate for poor Perez.

[biodroid]

Originally Posted by thaddeus6th

That's an.... optimistic suggestion

I'm glad Hamilton wasn't disqualified, that would've been a travesty as well.

Anyway, the next race should be quite exciting. Will Red Bull keep their dominance, will Button be naughty again and will Mercedes finish the race?

Hamilton should have been disqualified as he is too much of a golden boy for F1 and the FIA turns a blind eye, the commentators talk too much about Hamilton when Vettel has achieved the same status at a younger age. Hamilton can only win when drivers drop out in front of him, I think he is a talentless git. I would reckon the best driver on the grid would be Alonso, that man has the skill and is amazing even if he doesn't have the best car, just look at his style, he just needs to lose the "hot head" emotions while driving. Vettel could be the next Schumi but that still has to be seen.

[thaddeus6th]

Not so sure I agree Hamilton's seen as a golden boy. In Spa in 2008, I think, he was bizarrely penalised and had the victory taken from him, and later that year suffered the same penalty for being on the other side of the 'offence'.

Hamilton is very talented. Personally, I agree with you that Vettel is moreso, I think he's the best driver in the field. You don't equal Fernando Alonso in your first season without talent.

[biodroid]

Vettel surely has something going for him no can deny that but it is the first race, he needs to be consistent which looks like he is being at the moment. I just find McLaren and the drivers to be very arrogant like they are the royalty of F1 and they can do no wrong. I disagree with comparing Hamilton to Alonso in his rookie year, if Timo Glock hadn't conveniently moved out of the way for Hamilton, Massa would have won the championship. But Glock moved out of the way just in time for Hamilton to get enough points to win. There was no talent involved.

[thaddeus6th]

Glock didn't conveniently move out of the way, he stayed out on dry tyres when all around him had shifted to intermediates.

Edited extra bit: however, I've just remembered the Hamilton "fizzy drink company" comment. That was a bit stupid and arrogant. Besides, if a fizzy drink company can win both titles and a 'proper' team can't, what does that say about the 'proper' team?

Anyway, I don't have a particular affiliation to any team/driver, and the only one I dislike a bit is the grumpy Spaniard.

[biodroid]

He also commented on the backmarkers saying they are 'monkeys'. But a few races after he said it he was a backmarker for a while so he became a 'monkey' himself, I think he regretted that.

I agree Alonso is a grump but the man can drive. I am glad for Petrov getting that well earned 3rd place.

[Foxbat]

Whilst I am no fan of Hamilton the person, I think he is a fantastic driver. As for Alonso being a grump, he's never come across like that as far as I'm concerned.

He's passionate and gets upset when things go wrong (but so do many of us). You just have to listen to Hamilton's very public criticism of his team over the radio last year to see that he can be far grumpier than Alonso. And so can Vettel - remember his indicating the lunacy of Webber in Turkey? In almost everybody's opinion except Red Bull they thought he was to blame.

Bottom line is these guys are all out to win, all passionate about their sport....and all get a bit grumpy when things go wrong....that's Human nature. If I were a team manager I'd be worried if my driver didn't get upset when things went wrong. I'd also happily pay for a few door repairs if it meant a better result in the next race.

PS, I was at Spa 2008 and found out Hamilton had won back at the camp site 2 hours later. Not a good end to an absolutely fantastic race.

[thaddeus6th]

I would suggest that was more petulant than grumpy on Hamilton's part.

Regarding Vettel's crazy sign: my understanding is that Webber's engineer was told that Vettel was faster and that Webber was holding him up so much that Vettel would have to pass him or risk being overtaken by Hamilton. However, Webber never got the message and so left little room. So, Vettel thought Webber had deliberately disobeyed team orders at the cost of a Red Bull 1-2 (or possibly 1-3).

Didn't Massa 'win' at Spa 2008? Might be misremembering, but I thought Raikonnen and Hamilton duelled in the rain, Raikonnen crashed and Hamilton was disqualified by Ferrari International Assistance.

[Foxbat]

Yes, Massa was awarded the victory but (as you say) it was the ding-dong battle between Hamilton and Raikonnen that had the crowd on their feet. I was situated in the wooded slopes at the last corner where beer was flowing and barbecues were cremating cheap burgers. Those of us unfortunate to succumb to the mud and tumble down the slope were cheered and laughed at in a wonderfully good natured atmosphere.

It was probably the best race I've been to and was only marred by the fact that I felt slightly cheated finding out that, despite travelling to Belgium to witness it first hand, I only discovered the winner later when it was all over.

The FIA need to finalise the results much more rapidly than they do at present.

[biodroid]

Ferrari International Assistance I don't think that's the case but what really annoys me is when Hamilton does something remotely entertaining like going over a curb too fast and lifting the wheels the commentators have an orgasm and think that he just saved mankind, that's how much they love him. Here is a fantastic guy (Vettel) who is acutally driving his butt off to win but they would rather focus on Hamilton taking a dump in the bathroom. The reason I said he was revered as a golden boy is because he actually called Charlie Whiting while he was driving in a race to complain that the one driver was driving a bit dangerously please ask him to move so I can overtake. Why would someone do that? Because he has to ask the big guy to help him overtake instead of doing it himself, that's why I think he is talentless.

[thaddeus6th]

I'm not sure that's quite the case now. Allen and Legard got a bit, er, giddy about certain drivers. Brundle and Coulthard made a good time on their debut outing.

Edit: Also, we seem to be disagreeing on almost everything here

Anyway, I enjoyed the first race and hope that the second sees the McLarens able to take the fight to the Red Bulls. Given KERS is meant to be more important in Malaysia and the Red Bulls didn't have it in Oz, I wonder if they'll manage to reproduce such a lightning fast start.

[biodroid]

Vettel mentioned that he forgot about his KERS and when he pushed the button nothing happened. Has Allen left the commentary? I did notice Brundle and Coulthard were commenting for Oz, not that I don't mind I like Brundle and Coulthard is a bit reserved, they give a drivers view of the race where Allen was just too excited most of the time. I don't know if he ever drove a race car.

[thaddeus6th]

Allen left at the end of the 2008 season when ITV had their last race.

Then it was Legard, who annoyed me a bit, and now he's been axed and replaced with Coulthard.