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Old 26th June 2010, 11:12 AM   #376 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

For the weekend...

26th June

Uruguay 2 - 0 South Korea
USA 2 - 0 Ghana

27th June
Germany 2 - 1 England
Argentina 2 - 1 Mexico
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:16 AM   #377 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

HMMM...reading previous posts, I think Seph was thinking along similar lines to myself....

As I said, I'm happy to maintain the overall ladder and post on a regular basis, maybe every couple of days perhaps during the Round of 16? ...and have Wybern maintain the "stage" ladders.

Up to the group to decide I guess...
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:23 AM   #378 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ursa major View Post
This time, I'm using a system. I doubt it'll be any better than the previous wet-finger-in-the-air guesses. And I will be predicting a draw in the next four batches, in case anyone's wondering why I made a fuss about scoring draws () earlier.
So Ursa, are my scores essentially valid after either full time OR extra time the way I've posted them?? Obviously if I predict a draw then I need to elaborate viz a viz on penalties outcome. Have I got that basically correct?

If you don't reply to this query before tonight's games I'm going to assume I'm correct with the scorelines I've given as they could equally valid IMO for either a full time or extra time score and therefore no penalty shot outs are clearly being predicted by me in these instances...
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:24 AM   #379 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

As Wybren kindly puts up the table every day, we can all work out who did best in which round and in each stage.

Having said that, the idea of having competitions on each round gets more dubious as times passes: there are only two semi-finals, one final and one third place play-off.
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:28 AM   #380 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

Quote:
Originally Posted by GOLLUM View Post
So Ursa, are my scores essentially valid after either full time OR extra time the way I've posted them?? Obviously if I predict a draw then I need to elaborate viz a viz on penalties outcome. Have I got that basically correct?

If you don't reply to this query before tonight's games I'm going to assume I'm correct with the scorelines I've given as they could equally valid IMO for either a full time or extra time score and therefore no penalty shot outs are clearly being predicted by me in these instances...

My proposal was that we ignore whether extra time was played. So:
  • if one team has won over the ninety minutes, that's the scoreline, obviously;
  • if the teams are even after 90 minutes, we ignore that and only consider the scoreline at the end of extra time.
I think anything else would become too complicated.
.

Last edited by Ursa major; 26th June 2010 at 11:32 AM. Reason: Changed layout in a forlorn attempt to make it clearer
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:28 AM   #381 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

Weel....it doesn't worry me Ursa but I'm going to keep a tally of the overall leader if Wybern doesn't post that particular ladder.

Best to see what Wybern decides to "officially" post first I guess...
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:29 AM   #382 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ursa major View Post
My proposal was that we ignore whether extra time was played. So if oine team has won over the ninety minutes, that's the scoreline, obviously. If the teams are even after 90 minutes, we ignore that and only consider the scoreline at the end of extra time. And then, if that's still a draw, the penalty shootout.

I think anything else would become too complicated.
Agreed and clearly I did have the right idea then.....

Cheers.

EDIT: HE HE...don't you love it when someone edits their post like that?.... Good to see we are on the same page about the scoring methodology Mr. Bear. Keep this up and you may get the golden key to the Jacuzzi and Bar....
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:33 AM   #383 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ursa major View Post
As Wybren kindly puts up the table every day, we can all work out who did best in which round and in each stage.

Having said that, the idea of having competitions on each round gets more dubious as times passes: there are only two semi-finals, one final and one third place play-off.
We could either have a single stage from this point to the end of the competition OR perhaps 2 stages. Stage 1 = Round of 16. Stage 2 = Quarter finals and beyond right up to the Final and the 3rd place play off. Just an idea, so as to not complicate things with too many stages. Any good? I don't have a problem with just a single stage from now to the end of the competition either if that is what you were driving at?....

Shall be interesting to see what the other members think.
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:37 AM   #384 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

The complication would mainly come in giving the predictions.

So:
Quote:
It'll be 1-1 after 90 minutes, 2-2 after extra time and Team X will win on penalties, although they'll be 4-4 (in penalties) after the regulation first five each, and then Team X will win it 17-16 after 23 further rounds of penalties.
I'd rather we stuck with what we have: score line and (if the scoreline indicates a draw) who would win after penalties.
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:38 AM   #385 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

On careful consideration of everyone else's posts I have come to the conclusion that it is the consensus of everyone that we have a overall tally and a stages tally. Meaning everyone is set at 0 for the Round of 16 but also retains their current points for a running tally?

It is not hard to do the tallys and maintain 2 sets of sheets, as I already have it all up and running anyway. Also as a few people have dropped out and there is less games each nice, it is a tad easier.

SO in the words of our new PM

GAME ON
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:40 AM   #386 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

Phew....I'm sticking to the premise that a non-drawn scoreline indicates up to either full time or extra time the predicted scoreline is the predicted scoreline. A drawn scoreline requires members to indicate who wins on penalties. Whether you need to go into predicting the actual penalty scoreline is another matter. That probably makes it a wee bit too complicated IMO.

Back later....
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Old 26th June 2010, 11:43 AM   #387 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

And I didn't even mention yellow cards, red cards. (Oh, and straight reds)

And corners, substitutions, time in possession....







(But then this isn't about cricket or baseball. )
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Old 26th June 2010, 12:49 PM   #388 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wybren View Post
On careful consideration of everyone else's posts I have come to the conclusion that it is the consensus of everyone that we have a overall tally and a stages tally. Meaning everyone is set at 0 for the Round of 16 but also retains their current points for a running tally?

It is not hard to do the tallys and maintain 2 sets of sheets, as I already have it all up and running anyway. Also as a few people have dropped out and there is less games each nice, it is a tad easier.

SO in the words of our new PM

GAME ON
Sounds good to me, especially if I can catch that rascally Cull....

What's your take on the scoreline predictions Wybern?

I think posting a scoreline with a winning team should be enough independent of if it's full time or extra time.

So far folk have predicted just the team that wins on penalties if the indicated scoreline shows a "draw". I don't think it needs to be any more complicated than that; my below observations notwithstanding.

Sorry, I've not studied ALL of the previous posts but I would imagine that points would be..... if you predict the wining team you get a point end of story. If you predict the winning scoreline (no penalty shoot out) you get the 4 points or whatever the allocation is going to be. If it's a drawn game then what? Only those who predicted a penalty shootout are in the running for additional points and then simply the person who predicts the winning team after penalties gets the 4 points? Not entirely balanced but it sure makes it less complicated than having to assess penalty shootout scores and members having to predict that I feel.

*NB You may want to read my OR statement before reading Points 1 and 2 below as this may be what Ursa and co. intended/meant....

First point. The flaw I see here and it gets more tricky is....Those who predict the correct scoreline after potentially extra time, i.e. no penalty shoot out occurs, get 4 points which is OK. However, those who predict the winner after a penalty shootout is required I presume also get what the 4 points? If that is the case then they get the 4 points w/o having to predict the exact penalty shootout scoreline whereas the "extra timers" have to actually predict the exact scoreline to pick up their 4 points.

Then again you have to still predict a drawn match and penalty shootout, so perhaps that is OK on balance. Bear in mind the next point though....

Second point following on from the person in the case of a penalty shootout. By way of an example, Person 1 may predict Germany 2 - England 2 and Germany win on penalties, Person 2 predicts Germany 1 - England 1 and Germany win on penalties. The actual result is that Yes Germany win on penalties BUT the drawn scoreline is England 2 - Germany 2,. In this case you can see that Person 1 does not get any more points than person 2. Not entirely fair, if I have this correct?

OR
in this scenario of penalty shoot out contestants we say, OK you all predicted a penalty shootout BUT just 1 point and only if you guess the winning team. Extra points e.g. 4 only if you also predicted the actual drawn scoreline. This may be what Ursa was saying in his previous post. That would seem on balance a more reasonable way to handle things IMO. Only problem there is that those who predicted a drawn game AND who wins the penalty may only get a single point in the same way the "Extra timers" only get 1 point for predicting the winner if they do not then also post the correct scoreline. Seems slightly tougher on the penalty shootout members if that appears a reasonable way to score things??....

Time for a lie down....

Cheers.
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Old 26th June 2010, 03:13 PM   #389 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

argh! missed posting (anyone else had server troubles?).

The Uruguay/Korea match is 10 mins underway, so I'll save Wybren my pleas and cries and just let that one slip.

USA v Ghana 2-1
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Old 26th June 2010, 03:23 PM   #390 (permalink)
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Re: FIFA WC Tipping comp

Yes, I haven't been able to connect to the Chrons for the past 3 hours.



Gollum, you've just confused me beyond all hope of repair.
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