Sansa

[Culhwch]

Yeah, but the same can be said for a handful of characters. Why build up Ned through the first book, to lop his head off - when it can be argued he had unfinished business regarding Jon. Robb is built up throughout the series only to amazingly be offed in a scene no one saw coming. So why not let the Hound die without fulfilling what everyone sees as his destiny? It would be in the tradition of Martin bucking the standard fantasy conventions, in this case of foreshadowing - and foreshadowing pretty damn solidly, thinking back on all the times the Hound told us that Gregor was his to kill.

That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if he did live. Whether Martin would do it in such a way as to be either convincing or dissappointing... who really knows at this stage? Smart money is on convincing, though....

[I, Brian]

I should have thought Ned's demise was fairly predictable - and Robb was always distanced from the reader, so he often came across as expendable. Bran and Jon, not at all, but Robb and Rickon so far, yes. IMO, anyway.

[AryaUnderfoot]

Originally Posted by Culhwch

Yeah, but the same can be said for a handful of characters. Why build up Ned through the first book, to lop his head off - when it can be argued he had unfinished business regarding Jon. Robb is built up throughout the series only to amazingly be offed in a scene no one saw coming. So why not let the Hound die without fulfilling what everyone sees as his destiny? It would be in the tradition of Martin bucking the standard fantasy conventions, in this case of foreshadowing - and foreshadowing pretty damn solidly, thinking back on all the times the Hound told us that Gregor was his to kill.

That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if he did live. Whether Martin would do it in such a way as to be either convincing or dissappointing... who really knows at this stage? Smart money is on convincing, though....

The way I see it, while Ned had unfinished business regarding Jon, it wasn't his main driving force to live. There are others who can easily pick up the reins and tell Jon everything he needs to know about his parentage- he just needs to find them. However, the Hound's only real goal in life, now that he's not Joffrey's dog, is to kill his brother. It's tragic and pathetic, but honestly, seeing the Mountain killed by anyone else just wouldn't be quite as fulfilling to read.

Regardless, I'm going to have to put the book down and do a little dance when the Mountain finally meets his end.

[AryaUnderfoot]

Originally Posted by I, Brian

I should have thought Ned's demise was fairly predictable - and Robb was always distanced from the reader, so he often came across as expendable. Bran and Jon, not at all, but Robb and Rickon so far, yes. IMO, anyway.

I'll agree with you about Robb, I, Brian. But I think that Rickon will have a big part to play later in the books. I still wonder where he went...?

[Raven]

I think we can make some guesses on that, Arya.

First, Osha and Rickon took a different gate from the rest, so it seems fair to assume they took a different direction.

Second, Osha is perfectly well aware of the dangers in the North.

So probably not North.

What else? Well, if Osha is seeking safety and obscurity, Greywater Watch seems like the best bet. She has to go to someone loyal to the Starks, avoiding the Ironborn and the Boltons. Coupled with the fact that she has likely not gone North, that rules out the Umbers (she'd have to go near Bolton lands to get there).

Moreover, we know that she was planning to take the Kingsroad for a distance. That means either North or South, and if not North... then it has to be South, leaving Greywater Watch and White Harbour as most likely. But the latter is a big city, biggest in the North. It seems unlikely Osha would want to go there - she would be at a disadvantage, unfamiliar as she is with cities, and it would be harder to conceal Rickon there.

Greywater Watch has to be the best bet. Either that, or Osha is hiding out on her own...

[I, Brian]

Indeed, Rickon may not be set for death, but his lack of importance in the story so far gives George a lot of room to do different things with the character, and not all of them nice.

Bran, on the other hand, has been built up to such an importance that it would be impossible to kill him off any time soon.

[Lord Snow]

Even know this is a Sansa thread I'll put in my opinion on Rickon.I think he will live and play a bigger part maybe in The Dance.I think the lack of coverage of him is mainly do to his age.It is a hard thing to give a view point of a child so young,I have heard Martin say the same thing.I myself think he will make play a great part later.

[Culhwch]

Originally Posted by Raven

Greywater Watch has to be the best bet. Either that, or Osha is hiding out on her own...

A couple points there. Greywater is legendarily difficult to find, so what makes you think Osha could? Plus, even if she stumbled across it, or the crannogmen found her - which would be more likely - would Howland Reed believe this wilding woman and ragged boy is Rickon Stark and his protector? Rickon has the look of a Tully, and I can't remember mention of Howland meeting Catelyn (though I won't rule it out completely - been shot down far too many times on this here forum to declare anything with certainty anymore), so what proof could Osha present that Howland might accept them and place them under his protection? Of course, Howland is quite a spiritual man, or so it would seem, so he might know through some other means...

[Culhwch]

Originally Posted by I, Brian

I should have thought Ned's demise was fairly predictable - and Robb was always distanced from the reader, so he often came across as expendable. Bran and Jon, not at all, but Robb and Rickon so far, yes. IMO, anyway.

I first read them five years ago, so it's hard to recall exactly, but I think I was fairly shocked when Ned got the chop. And Robb, too. But my point was more that Martin surprises more often than meets expectations. He's not the kind of writer who delivers the neatly packaged endings his readers want, which is what I would see a Hound-recovers-and-kills-the-Mountain storyline being.

[Raven]

Culhwch: certainly, I can't think of a time when Cat might have met Howland. Howland has not been at WF for years, and I'm assuming Cat's never seen Greywater Watch either. Possibly at her wedding to Ned?

ETA - this isn't a major problem anyway: Howland certainly knows that Ned married a Tully, so a kid who looks like a Tully claiming to be Ned's son shouldn't cause him much difficulty. And Shaggydog might provide extra credentials - who but a Stark is wandering around with a direwolf in tow?

Add to that any special abilities Howland might have, as you say, and this just doesn't seem like an issue.

At any rate, I imagine that Osha would manage these obstacles - she will have to manage far worse as Rickon's protector.