General Weird discusion thread

[j. d. worthington]

The Smoking Leg is the volume containing his "The Bad Lands", which Lovecraft praised (rightly, in my estimation). His work in general deserves to be more known than it is....

[Lobolover]

Yep,but sadly thats the only online tale I've found.

On another note-what do you think about Shiel?For instance,did you like "The Pale ape" and "The case of Euphemia Raphash" (im reading the rest of the book) .And-returning to Cram-is "White Villa"
a good choice? (horrormasters.com have the whole volume from which "the dead valley" came-too bad they dont have de la Mare's "the tree")

Also-I wonder if Shiel ever heard of Lovecraf,seeing as he was asking for an acquiring of reprint rights to his tales by WT.

[AE35Unit]

Is this the Shiel as in MP Shiel of The Purple Cloud?(i have that book on my bookmooch wishlist)
I know nothing about him but thought he was an early 20th century science fiction writer. Yet he wrote horror too?

[j. d. worthington]

LL -- that does complicate matters, yes. All I can suggest is to keep an eye out for used copies of one of the editions of the collection online. IIRC, when I found it a few years ago, it was going for an extremely reasonable price....

As for the two Shiel stories: I don't recall the second right offhand, and may not have got around to that one; but the first I recall as being rather flawed, but at points quite effective....

That particular tale of Cram's is... negligible. Written well enough, but not particularly memorable in concept. And as for Shiel... I'm sure he did know about HPL, as he and August Derleth had (iirc) considerable contact....

Originally Posted by AE35Unit

Is this the Shiel as in MP Shiel of The Purple Cloud?(i have that book on my bookmooch wishlist)
I know nothing about him but thought he was an early 20th century science fiction writer. Yet he wrote horror too?

The same. And, like many writers of the period, yes, he wrote both. In part, this is because there wasn't such a divide between the two as we see nowadays -- in fact, that didn't come into quite such common practice until the 1970s or 1980s, and for a long while these and the various forms of fantasy were all considered as part of the overall umbrella of "fantastic literature"....

[Lobolover]

In fact,id prefer if there wasnt.Some of history's best weird tales came out before.

Hmm.So,if we disregard that,the colection has theese other tales

No. 252 Rue M. Le Prince
In Kropfsberg KeepSister Maddelena
Notre Dame des Eaux

Which one of those would be good to read? (and is "White villa" realy that bad?)

To "The Palle Ape"-hmm,well,I thought it was just a tad rushed.But stil,very good.

On a related note-
how about "The Place Called Dagon"-you read that yet?

[AE35Unit]

Thanks JD. What would we do without you!

[j. d. worthington]

Originally Posted by Lobolover

In fact,id prefer if there wasnt.Some of history's best weird tales came out before.

In many ways (not all, but many) I think I'd tend to agree with you.

Hmm.So,if we disregard that,the colection has theese other tales

No. 252 Rue M. Le Prince
In Kropfsberg KeepSister MaddelenaNotre Dame des Eaux

Which one of those would be good to read? (and is "White villa" realy that bad?)

It's not that it's bad -- Cram was a good writer, and it's well written. It's just not particularly memorable or eerie. As for the others... the best would be "No. 252 Rue M. Le Prince", which is certainly one of the most powerful haunted house tales I've encountered. It has some similarities to Bulwer's "The Haunters and the Haunted; or, the House and the Brain", but also quite enough differences to be its very own story... and some immensely powerful stuff is in there. "In Kropfsberg Keep" is a lesser tale, but still quite memorable. The others tend toward a more benign sort of ghostly tale. Good in their way, but they stay with the reader less, I tend to think....

Incidentally, have you seen this collection?

The Haunters & The Haunted by Various - Project Gutenberg

You may find some worthwhile things to keep you busy there (it's a new one on me, too, but the TOC looks quite impressive....)

To "The Palle Ape"-hmm,well,I thought it was just a tad rushed.But stil,very good.

I think I'd agree with that.

On a related note-
how about "The Place Called Dagon"-you read that yet?

Yes. Some time back, though. However, I recall that it was an interesting novel, and a fairly quick read, but the actual eerie elements were exceptionally subtle, and left ambiguous enough to fit within the Gothic school in many ways....

Originally Posted by AE35Unit

Thanks JD. What would we do without you!

*ahem* I always feel more than a little awkward when people say things like this.... *blush*

[Lobolover]

My favourite moment is Westcott's "chambersian" speach:"He walks th ehills-he whistles to the sacred goat and snaps his fingers at the moon and stars.In the dark palms of his hands is all the power of the earth.He stands at the place called Dagon and his feat are routed like mountains."

Dont know the colection-but thanks,I also found ,finaly,a e-text of "The house and the brain"-I also downloaded theese stories from it:

TEIG O'KANE AND THE CORPSE (the tales flavour will be abit sour cause of it being the souce of a Hellboy tale I read

7. THE BOTATHEN GHOST (the words "pestilential disease" and dates in the 1600's got my atention)

9. DR DUTHOIT'S VISION

10. THE SEVEN LIGHTS by Machen

11. THE SPECTRAL COACH OF BLACKADON
And "The Pool in the graveyard" for which I have high hopes.

Thanks for the references,downloaded Kopfsberg,now only need to do number 252.

Apart from that-what do you think about Buchan?

[j. d. worthington]

All I believe I've ever read by Buchan were: The 39 Steps (a veeerrrrry long time ago); The Runagate's Club, Grey Weather, and Witch Wood. I quite liked each of them, though R.C. only has 3 tales which even have an eerie atmosphere at all, and one of them has a naturalistic ending, while "The Green Wildebeeste" failed to capture my imagination -- not enough emotional prepration, I thought. Witch Wood, though, remains my favorite. Grey Weather has some lovely stuff in it, but I certainly wouldn't class it as "weird"....

[Lobolover]

Realy?I actualy was positively enthraled by "The green wildebeast".Very imaginative.

Skulle Skerry couldve become a classic of modern horror,with just the FINAL LINE being diferent-A true letdown.I think you could give "the wildebeast" another chance.

Witch wood-havent read it,but its the only thing HPL remoneds left.

PS:Made a thread about Auriol and Stoker's "The lair of the white worm", Id apreciate a coment of yours.

Geting to HPL-we talked abot him being mad about what Derleth did to his creations-well I think he WOULD mind ,if he re-inteprates his characters,in a "postuhunous colaboration" adoring Lovecraft's name PRIMARILY.

HPL-Bierce-I wonder if he ever comented on "An inhabitant of Carcossa", when he did on Haita the shepherd,a purely fantastical tale.

Also-to Ewers-theres been a more recent edition of "Sorcerers aprentice" and antiquebook has Alraune for ca. 15.70 US !

Moving along the list:you read "The Dyhbuk"?

[j. d. worthington]

Originally Posted by Lobolover

Realy?I actualy was positively enthraled by "The green wildebeast".Very imaginative.

Skulle Skerry couldve become a classic of modern horror,with just the FINAL LINE being diferent-A true letdown.I think you could give "the wildebeast" another chance.

I plan on doing so eventually; but I've so much else to read before that point, that it's going to be quite a long time....

Witch wood-havent read it,but its the only thing HPL remoneds left.

Subtle, understated, and ambiguous. Also (as HPL notes) stuffed full of dialect, which may be off-putting to some (though I personally found it enhanced the novel).

PS:Made a thread about Auriol and Stoker's "The lair of the white worm", Id apreciate a coment of yours.

I'll take a look and see if I've anything to contribute to the discussion.

Geting to HPL-we talked abot him being mad about what Derleth did to his creations-well I think he WOULD mind ,if he re-inteprates his characters,in a "postuhunous colaboration" adoring Lovecraft's name PRIMARILY.

First... where does Derleth reinterpret any of Lovecraft's characters? His alien beings/concepts, yes (to some degree), but those are by no means characters in his stories. And on that point... he'd seen that done by quite a few, and showed no sign of being at the least riled -- gave suggestions on how they could improve stories, sometimes, but never took exception to any of these concepts being manipulated. This is in large part, I'd say, because of several things:

1) it wasn't his own original material that was being changed (something he would have had a fit about)

2) he himself noted that he thought it rather a good idea (not to mention entertaining) to have several different people contributing to these myth-patterns, as it gave them more the flavor of the real thing ... and real myths themselves often have widely divergent views of the same concepts

3) he always supported a writer following their own muse in their writing; even where they were basing work on some of his ideas, if their particular muse took them in a different direction with it, he seemed to prefer them honestly following their tack with such concepts rather than "towing the line" of his.

4) he himself altered different things between his own original work and the "collaborations" or ghost-written tales he did which involved these concepts; sometimes quite radically; so he was hardly likely to complain when someone else -- whom he had encouraged to use these things if they found them inspiring a tale -- did the same.

While Lovecraft was extremely protective of his own original prose works, his concepts he was much more generous with, even volunteering story ideas to colleagues when he found himself not moved to write about them. (A very intriguing example of this is his sending the suggestion that CAS utilize the very story germ he had in his Commonplace Book concerning mental time travel and a man finding a document written in his own hand; which, of course, he later used for his own "The Shadow Out of Time"....) The above is based on things stated in his letters -- not always to the writer involved, and (given that he wasn't one to hold back on his opinion concerning such things) even more likely to be an honest representation of his feelings than those directed to said writers might have been.

HPL-Bierce-I wonder if he ever comented on "An inhabitant of Carcossa", when he did on Haita the shepherd,a purely fantastical tale.

Not in his public utterances, that I recall. I do remember, though, something in his letters, but I'd have to go through the various indexes and track that down....

Also-to Ewers-theres been a more recent edition of "Sorcerers aprentice" and antiquebook has Alraune for ca. 15.70 US !

Moving along the list:you read "The Dyhbuk"?

I've not seen any recent editions of either of the Ewers so far (though a friend of mine picked up a recent edition of the latter. I have the earlier American printings, with the illustrations by Mahlon Blaine, though....

Yes, I did read The Dybbuk, a very long time ago. Most of these that I read (except for the more famous names, which have been fairly easy to find) were around a quarter of a century ago, which is why my memory of them is sometimes a bit vague....

[Lobolover]

I didnt,so im only asking if its good.

I inted to read Witch Wood,but ive got lots on my list too.

Ps:Thanks for the recomendation,finished "In Kopfsber Keep" (though I honestly dont know about Cram's idea of German),realy good (inspired me to write my own story,though similar in spirit only) -though you notice that anytime some people resolve to go to a haunted house-practicaly the WHOLE villiage goes with them?

Im yet to do the other one,just geting into "All hallows" on the comp,plus reading "The house of sounds" by Shiel in book form AND listening to "The turn of the screw" by Henry James (similar to "the lair of the w.worm in chapter number and length)

Pps:Ive found a german edition (new) of BOTH Alraune and Sorcerers aprentice in ONE book for 9.50 euro-but I dont got a credit card that works now and they only have one-keep on hoping that Ewers is obscure enough.

[j. d. worthington]

Glad you enjoyed the tale, and I would imagine you'll not be disappointed in the other. Good luck, also, with the Ewers. Keep me posted on that one...

By the way... HPL mentions Mrs. H. D. Everett's collection The Death Mask in his SHiL; in case you haven't found this elsewhere, it has been reprinted in both a rather scarce edition through Ghost Story Press in 1995, and also (under the title The Crimson Blind and Other Stories) through Wordsworth Editions -- both of the latter include two tales not in the original edition, iirc....

[Lobolover]

Hmm.Havent realy checked it out,ill try to see .

Ps:im going through said ghost stories colection and Ive found a certan story I have high hopes for-but ill give definite judgmenet when I finish it.

[Lobolover]

Which reminds me-youve ever read any Chambers pastiches,like "Rehersals for oblivion" collection?