short story vs. novel

[Quanders]

Searching for short story ideas, I've ended up with 2-3 concepts I thought would make interesting sci-fi tales. (these were paired down from many more)

However while reworking the concepts, I see where the stories could each potentially become developed into emergent novels.

While I realize authors choose to base novels on their own short stories, can anyone offer some insight?

My basic strategy is to first have published a few short stories, that will at the same time let me massage other space themes. With writing skills and style expected to advance as I venture further on to the novel form.

[Urlik]

not a bad plan of action. in fact very similar to much of Michael Moorcock's work where short stories are expanded or even combined to make novels (not exactly true but the omnibus editions of the Hawkmoon/Runestaff books could easily be novels)

Moorcock even re-edited some of his earlier short stories after later works were published so that they would fit more neatly into the timeline of the later books

[chrispenycate]

My two pennyworth.
If an idea fits into a short story, comfortably, without straining, write it so. commercial considerations apart (the market for short stories is much diminished from the golden age of pulps) a great short stays in the head for decades (think of Clarke's "The star" or "The nine billion names of god") and require meticulous crafting; experience that just has to be useful later on.

But, best of all, short stories can be done faster: allowing more width of experience, they are easier to completely overhaul, less agony to throw out when they don't work out(well, slightly less agony, anyway.)

And not all ideas demand their own trilogy to investigate all their corners; ideas are the size they come, and I can think of at least two novels which should have stayed as novellas, but financial considerations got them padded out - ugh.

And if it turns out that the idea refuses to be squeezed down, needs the extra breathing space, what have you lost (unless you've already sold it as five thousand words, and now have to put it on such a rigourous diet it will come out pale and sickly)

I mourn the passing of the short story market; so many great ideas in SF fitted in.

[iansales]

Originally Posted by Quanders

My basic strategy is to first have published a few short stories, that will at the same time let me massage other space themes. With writing skills and style expected to advance as I venture further on to the novel form.

I suspect you might be suffering under a few misapprehensions. Writing is difficult, and getting published is even harder. you can't expect to knock out a couple of short stories and sell them, treating each as a learning process. You will never stop learning, and you might never ever sell a short story.

And writing a novel is entirely different skill. Some people are better at novels than short stories, and vice versa. Some people can write both. But short sotires certainly aren't a way of "training" yourself to write a novel.

From your use of "space themes", I also think you might need to research the science fiction market a little better. I know of no writer, magazine or editor who uses that phrase to describe sf.

[lathark]

Perspiration, not inspiration, gets the novel writen, in my opinion, but it does not guarantee publication, which requires positive intervention, usually in short supply, so consider perseverance your best friend, and procrastination, your enemy.

So, writing, any writing, will teach you things. But it's how you get up from your failures that will decide how it ends.

[Urlik]

Originally Posted by chrispenycate

My two pennyworth.
If an idea fits into a short story, comfortably, without straining, write it so. commercial considerations apart (the market for short stories is much diminished from the golden age of pulps) a great short stays in the head for decades (think of Clarke's "The star" or "The nine billion names of god") and require meticulous crafting; experience that just has to be useful later on.

But, best of all, short stories can be done faster: allowing more width of experience, they are easier to completely overhaul, less agony to throw out when they don't work out(well, slightly less agony, anyway.)

And not all ideas demand their own trilogy to investigate all their corners; ideas are the size they come, and I can think of at least two novels which should have stayed as novellas, but financial considerations got them padded out - ugh.

And if it turns out that the idea refuses to be squeezed down, needs the extra breathing space, what have you lost (unless you've already sold it as five thousand words, and now have to put it on such a rigourous diet it will come out pale and sickly)

I mourn the passing of the short story market; so many great ideas in SF fitted in.

I am glad you mentioned those two shorts by Clarke, they are not so much favourites of mine as totally unforgettable journeys into the world of "what if......?"

some of my favourite books are anthologies of shorts and the aspect of them that impresses me so much is the way the authors have managed to create a believable society and cultural setting, so different to that which we know, with so few words.

I too mourn the passing of the short story and believe it to be the sting in the tail of the popular success of Sci Fi.
many of the great writers wrote shorts for magazines, while others edited those same magazines, but with the expansion of the market and the demand for longer, more detailed settings, and plots dealing with weightier issues, those writers had the opportunites to write their magna opera and the magazines fell by the wayside.

now, the short stories seem to go through Hollywood and straight to video (they'll recoup the investment if there are enough explosions and special effects without the need for a coherant plot or developed characters or background) in the producers' mistaken belief that pulp refers to the content rather than the medium it was printed on.
the better short stories usually end up in comics and graphic novels intended for the mid teen to young adult market where much of the description is replaced by artwork.

the best market for short stories now is probably women's weekly magazines, and sci fi isn't one of their regular themes unless you deal with culture clash and romance in a sci fi setting.

[iansales]

The short story is as atrong as it's ever been, and there are many sf magainzes - both paper and web-based - out there. There's very little money to be made writing short fiction, but then there never really has been.

Few sf short stories are made into films. I've no idea where you got that from. If they are, it's usually those by established names.

[Urlik]

sorry, I didn't make myself clear

the short stories going to film was more a dig at the screen writers who saw the success of sci fi as a film genre in the late 70s and churned out hollow pastiches with not much content but plenty of flashing lights based on an idea rather than a full blown plot.

[iansales]

What does that have to do with short stories?

[Quanders]

From your use of "space themes", I also think you might need to research the science fiction market a little better. I know of no writer, magazine or editor who uses that phrase to describe sf.

iansales,

By space themes I simply mean the general notion which the story/premise is set against.

- I'm working toward a single main story that drives my life.

Too, this may spiritual fiction as much as sf.