Creatures in fantasy world

[Threddy]

If you have Orcs and Elves etc. does it seem right to you to have sheep and cows as well?
Just wondered because some authors create all-new creatures with new names etc.
Some just use normal creatures but have a new race of evil.
What do you think?
Ed - Threddy

[asher marquering]

i say put the normal creatures in lotr had rabbits

"filthy fat hobbit you ruins it"

so yeah i say put the normal creatures in

[power to the J]

Well...

First off, I think you should get rid of 'orcs and elves etc.' as you put it. Perhaps put easy-to-kill monsters that come in large packs in your story, but don't call them orcs. In WoT, Trollocs are pretty much equivalent to orcs (come in packs, killed easily) but since they are described differently and are called something else they stand out. That's what you need your story to do, and if it's all about orcs and elves, it wont. Before you think of what creatures to include in your world that are in ours, try to think of original creatures that aren't in ours.

Second, I don't see any problem with using animals from our world. If you call a rabbit a shelten, then explain a shelten to me for half a page, what's the point? Include all the lions, birds, horses and wolves (how many fantasy novels have wolves in them?) that you want.

Third, if you want to create all new creatures, it depends on what tense your in, or who your POV character is. If your protagonist (or just point-of-view when the creature arrives) is a farmer or fisher or small timer that has never seen the creature before, she/he can easily describe the creature as: It looked like a monkey and a donkey. Not a good description, or a good creature, but you get my point. But, if your main character is a Commander of Lord Thurac's 2nd Division, then he/she has probably seen a lot, and has probably seen your creature before. Then, if said creature appeared in a battle, it would just be: I saw a Rauger moving to me, and I hacked at it. Since we don't know what a Rauger is, we all have different views of it. If you want your prose to flow, I wouldn't suggest incorporating a description in that moment. If a tiger attacked you, would you think: This tiger walks on four legs, with black-and-orange striped fur. Or, if your new creature is an everyday thing that is always walking around, you wouldn't describe that much in real life, unless it's an abnormal thing. For example would you say: The dog strolled past me. It had long ears, dark fur, and was know to bark once in a while. Unless it was: The dog was lime green, and had a knife jutting from its one eye. But, if you use a different POV (I think it's 3PO, but I can't remember) then you can put in those descriptions, a la Tolkien.

Hope this helps you a bit. Good luck with your writing.

[jenna]

It always helps me to think of the world I create as being a parallel world to ours. So some things transfer over, like landscapes, climates, creatures etc. But other things are different - history, magic, different creatures etc. Because if you can't use sheep and cows, can you really use humans? Or verbal language? Or trees? Or earthly foods? Or earthly inventions? The list goes on forever. Just use what you want in your story, it's your world after all..

(But I do agree about not using Orcs and Elves. Definitely try to invent something new, if you can.. If not, just give them a different name..)

[Daniel Hetberg]

From the turkey city lexicon of SFF writing no-nos:

• "Call a Rabbit a Smeerp"
  A cheap technique for false exoticism, in which common elements of the real world are re-named for a fantastic milieu without any real alteration in their basic nature or behavior. "Smeerps" are especially common in fantasy worlds, where people often ride exotic steeds that look and act just like horses. (Attributed to James Blish.)

I personally like the word smeerp, but this criticism captures the essence of the issue quite clearly.

[Threddy]

I was going to include orcs in the first book which is easy enough to change.
But in the second, i was going to have 4 types of Elf - Wood, High, Night and Blood - Harder to change.
I can see your point about changing them but I might not. Paolini has elves and dwarves.
Ed - Threddy

[Culhwch]

Originally Posted by Threddy

Paolini has elves and dwarves.

As does Feist, Tokien, Pratchett, Brooks, World of Warcraft, Dungeons and Dragons, and god alone knows how many others. That's the point. It's a bit cliche. Particularly with a schema of high, wood, night and blood. I'd suggest giving serious thought to reimagining them.

[pyan]

Originally Posted by Threddy

Paolini has elves and dwarves.
Ed - Threddy

Not really a recommendation, that.....

The problem, Threddy, is with those names, they're always going to be compared to others in the genre.

[Manarion]

Originally Posted by Culhwch

As does Feist, Tokien, Pratchett, Brooks, World of Warcraft, Dungeons and Dragons, and god alone knows how many others. That's the point. It's a bit cliche. Particularly with a schema of high, wood, night and blood. I'd suggest giving serious thought to reimagining them.

Like me, kind of. I have a strange race I call Akuntas that are an alchemic mix of wolf, human, elf, troll, and wraith. Rather nasty creatures, actually....

[j. d. worthington]

Have to add my vote to the "reconsider this" camp. If you've any interest in writing itself, rather than just writing something that's an hommage to a writer (or writers) you like, then the best thing to do is to tell the stories that are in you and eschew anything that is reminiscent of others as much as possible; at least until you've established your own voice and feel comfortable in your own skin as a writer. Then, if you want to do such a tribute, you can do so without creating a straitjacket or a false label for yourself. And I have to agree with Pyan on Paolini. Whether you feel the books are good or bad, I don't think anyone who's literate (especially in fantasy) would argue that they're derivative; and therefore not likely to last. Right now, it's something of a nine-day's-wonder; but on the tenth day, something else will come along and by the twelfth it is likely few will remember these books even existed. I get the feeling you'd like something a little better for your own work than that....

[Hilarious Joke]

I think the use of elves is fairly low in importance. Character development, plot, emotion, and the texturing of your world with cultures and histories I believe have much more of an impact than whether you use races that have been used before.

[Green]

I'd agree with that. I have nothing against elves and orcs, unless they're paper-thin rehashes of all the other ones I've ever read.

Make them different, make them realistic, make them interesting... and if you can do that I'll be hooked.

[fire_elf20]

I would say use elves ect... just make them your own make them deep give some thought to what you write and you will be fine.

[Daniel Hetberg]

It's true that the creatures/races in your world should be your own and not just rehashes, but to be honest I'd happily apply the "smeerp" rule to elves as well. If you want elves, don't call them something else just to be different. However, I do agree with the blood/high/wood whatever elves, these are fairly specific, as opposed to just "elves" with is quite generic and could be anything. Don't just copy and paste them.

Fantasy has some clichés going, but not all of them must be abandoned in order to make something readable.

P.S.: I read Paolini's Eragon, and while I enjoyed it enough to get the second book, it _is_ a fairly bland mix of Star Wars and generic Tolkien-esque fantasy. It's an achievement to get something on that scale written and published, but I doubt it will be remembered as a big masterpiece in ten years. Bit like Edding's Belagriad saga maybe, many people have bought and read it, but it's not actually good or innovative. Hm, don't know if these comments justify the flame proof suit... probably not.

[Threddy]

Thanks for the advice. I'll definitely think this through.
The problem is I've pictured all of this in my mind and i've pictured elves and orcs so it would be easier to write about. But if I just rename them(smeerp idea) then it will be obvious that I've just renamed them and then it seems kinda tacky and I might as well of stuck to the original names.
I'm confused now, but thanks anyway.
Ed - Threddy