Going Postal

[Winters_Sorrow]

Good to hear, especially as that's not his finest work (IMO)

try Soul Music for a next one...

[isoneri]

I thought this book was genius, yet again Terry Pratchett makes real life seem close but yet so far...By the way i have a signed map of the discworld, i met him years ago at a signing, nice guy.

[Thadlerian]

Pratchett's books just seem to get better and better, but this one was sort of a small letdown for me.

Let me say at first: The plot, the characters (especially them), the jokes, all this is great, perhaps even the best this far.

However, it's inevitably a very preachy book. When the message is so obvious and unsubtle, it can mar the best plots.

The big bad guy here is the Grand Trunk Company; legal theft, sabotage, obese and ridiculously helpless capitalists; it's not hard to spot. On page 72-73 Lord Vetinari delivers a political monologue at almost a whole page lenght. After his clonclusion, the book goes:
"Lord Vetinari opened his eyes. The men around the table were staring at him."
Through the preceding books, I've got to know Vetinari as the quiet, confident ruler who pulls the strings to make Ankh-Morpork run, but here it seems to me he's simply showing off. Why does he do that? He doesn't need to show off, he doesn't need to impress other people.

Then, near the end, there is this "message from the dead people", which we know was written by Moist. There's context of the message; the idea of "Sending Home" and other eerie clacks mythologies. But the actual text of the message sounds like a statement from a French student union in 1968, or something like that, with all its polemic agitatiton.

Some people say Going Postal might be a satire on Ayn Rand's Atlas Shrugged. That would certainly explain why all the opponents (except Reacher Gilt) appear to be political strawmen. It'll also explain why the good guys feel the need to deliver long politcal speeches.
But I feel that Discworld by now has abandoned the specific parodies to instead work on its own characters. Is he then using a dear character like Vetinari for this purpose? Oh well, I don't know.

To sum it up, Pratchett has in this book a rather obvious agenda against big, centralized capitalism/market liberalism. On which I agree with him: These big corporations hurt both individuals and society. But when his criticisms of corporations surface this openly and indiscreetly, it's hard not to be conscious of them. Any reader who agrees with market liberalism can easily root out the political message and ignore it.

Here's the problem: When it comes to capitalism, Pratchett simply isn't very good at satirising, as we have seen already in Johnny and the Dead; it tends to deteriorate to stereotypes and clichés about evil, fat men in suits who instantly panic whenever people speak up against them. He makes market liberalism seem silly and harmless, which it most certainly isn't.

And this is really sad, as Pratchett seems to make such good observations on all sorts of other stuff; heroism, war, nationalism, revolutions, religion, social issues, and so on.

But capitalism? Leave it to Jasper Fforde!

[pyan]

Originally Posted by Thadlerian

But I feel that Discworld by now has abandoned the specific parodies to instead work on its own characters.

I get the impression that, apart from one or two early books, especially TCOM, TP was always inventing and writing about his own characters, and fitting parodies of well-known personages around them( eg the Hogfather ). Certainly I can't see any of his main, book-carrying, characters (Vimes, Carrot, Esme Weatherwax, etc) being specific parodies of anyone else in the genre. However, I will give you Rincewind, (in my opinion one of the weakest of the main threads), and Vetinari as parodic of wizards and city-rulers in general, but I also think that Vetinari has outgrown parody to become as unique a character as you will find.

In fact, the more I think on this, the more I wonder what others may think, so I'm going to start a new thread on the subject. Please, someone, cut me off if it's been covered before.

[iratebeaver]

going postal is one of my favorites.
another good one is called The Johnny Maxwell Trilogy
the three books are in it are Only You Can Save Mankind; Johnny and the Dead; Johnny and the Bomb
all three are fairly short but really good

[alicebandassassin]

I liked going postal i am finding now that as the new books come out there is more time to refine caractors and give you a new veiw on them past and present.Aswell as introducing new faces.I also found the johnny maxwell books a good stating place for teen readers but still good enough to steal and read myself

[CarlottaVonUberwald]

i thin kthat although i loved 'going posta'l, i did give me quite strong memories of 'the truth'...

[pyan]

I agree, much as Carpe Jugulum was very similar to Lords and Ladies

[CarlottaVonUberwald]

glad soemone else see's it..it doesn't make it a bad book.....it's jsut such a similar feel

[The Ace]

Just re-read it, when you consider real life the Grand Trunk is a little close to home, but it was nice seeing the baddies done over at the end. I just hope that TP has something tuly horrible lined up for Slant in the near future as he gives lawyers a bad name. To be honest, I liked the way that the golems seem to be developing as viable members of society, actually becoming people rather than tools. Only Pratchett could have come up with literally buying your freedom, though. I didn't really find the book preachy, but that was probably because I agreed with its sentiments and I'd really like to see more of Moist von Lipwig and Killer.

[bookaholic]

its cool isnt it? some people dont like it much but i think all t.p's books are the best!

[I, Brian]

Haven't read a Pratchett for a few years now but read Going Postal this week - thought it was a really great book - well written and well executed. Smooth and fast reading from beginning to end.

The con-artist character was quite superb - the way he constantly ups the stakes simply for showmanship, then struggles on how he's going to make the impossible, possible.

I liked the ending, too - the decision to change tact I think was a clever one.

And while Pratchett is obviously railing at stereotypes, the trouble is, it's easy to see truth in what he says. Which is all the more important in comedy.

[Joel007]

Postal was great, one of the best. (With TP's work that's high praise).

I'm glad terry defied his publishers and strayed from the rincewind only books. It makes for a lot more variety and some great parodies. Although does anyone have a list or something of the books and what they're mainly a parody of?

[chrispenycate]

Originally Posted by Joel007

Postal was great, one of the best. (With TP's work that's high praise).

I'm glad terry defied his publishers and strayed from the rincewind only books. It makes for a lot more variety and some great parodies. Although does anyone have a list or something of the books and what they're mainly a parody of?

I herby submit a trial list. Since every book drifts off subject, makes social or literary comments outside its main theme, and doesn't nescessarily avoid themes covered in other books, and everyone gets his or her personal message out of each book, and some subjects (like Bloody Stupid Johnson) recur frequently while never becoming principal subjects; well, just about everyone will disagree with me, and every single one of them be right.

1. The Colour of Magic-----General Fantasy clichés
2. The Light Fantastic------Idem, speciality heroic fantasy
3. Equal Rites -------------Witchcraft, wizardry, sexual roles
4. Mort--------------------Death ,
5. Sourcery----------------High wizardry
6. Wyrd Sisters ------------Shakespeare, witches. rural life
7. Pyramids----------------Egyptology
8. Guards! Guards!---------Heroism, Dragons,
9. Eric---------------------the Faust legend
10. Moving Pictures---------Hollywood, racism
11. Reaper Man-------------Death, indutrialisation and beaurocracy
12. Witches Abroad --------Witches, travel documentaries, fairy stories
13. Small Gods ------------- Religion, Nationalism
14. Lords and Ladies--------Witches (again) the little people, celtic mythology
15. Men at Arms------------Racism, detective novels, city
16. Soul Music--------------The music business
17. Interesting Times--------Oriental stereotypes, barbarian invasions
18. Maskerade ------------- Mainly opera and travel, cookbooks
19. Feet of Clay--------------Racism, detective novels, city
20. Hogfather----------------Christmas, ex-pagan festivals in general
21. Jingo---------------------Nationalism. racial stereotypes
23. Carpe Jugulum------------General horror, particularly (evidently) Vampire fiction
22. The Last Continent-------Australian stereotypes, time travel paradoxes
24. The Fifth Elephant--------Outdoor horror + aristocracy, monsters
25. The Truth----------------The press
The Last Hero----------------Heroic fantasy, invention, polytheism
26. Thief of Time--------------Eastern mysticism, time travel, chocolate
27. Night Watch--------------Revolution, civil war
28. Monstrous Regiment-------War, sexism, nationalism.
29. Going Postal --------------Big business, tradition vs. innovaton
30. Thud! --------------------Racism, deeply rooted prejudice
***Amazing Maurice and His Educated Rodents-Con men, progress
***The Wee Free Men-------------------------Fantasy vs quantum

[Joel007]

Thanks for your thoughful list! That makes a lot of sense to me, I always wondered if he targeted specific books or just "life issues" as well.

Never heard of the Faust legend though.