Chapter Length.

[Cyricus]

Some of you people here mention the structure of your chapter(s), something like ending chapter as the scene ends. So, many of you write chapters that consist some action, one scene.

But is there anyone that has 2 or more "storylines" (although one is main, of course) in the same chapter? Like, more main characters, and more points of view (each NPC in my book has it's own point of view). But, unlike G. R. R. Martin's ASoIaF, I have more "parts of the same chapter" (you know, 'in the meantime', separated with symbols '* * *') and more scenes in one chapter. Okay, it is logical, for my chapters are long.

How do you guys (who write similar type of chapters) separate the action, begin and end those separated "parts of the chapters" and its' actions/scenes?

[pyan]

A lot of people who do this mention the name of the main character in the location you've switched to. When it's done in the first sentence of the new point-of-view part of the chapter it seems to work quite well.

[The Pelagic Argosy]

I frequently like to refer back to books I've read to look up favorite lines, reread favorite scenes, etc., and I need to check my facts when I discuss a book online. In which case, chapter titles are very helpful. Just something to keep in mind.

[WriterDoug]

If done properly in a story that can benefit from such, I think chapter titles are a great idea. They can function as brief "teasers" for the reader of what is to come in the following pages, and they work especially well for stories that jump around in time, but there are certainly exceptions to any rule.

I also find chapter titles to be tremendously helpful for recalling sections of a book, for when the reader finds it necessary to dig up information at a later date. If the novel or series contains a Table of Contents, then this will further facilitate that process.

For the guy(s) asking about knowing when to intelligibly divide chapters and/ or scenes, I will never profess to be absolutely certain either, but I can at least throw in my two cents on the matter.

I generally have scenes that just float around in my mind, and (hopefully) the connecting of them all creates a novel. Though maybe not vital, for me each of the scenes must present a problem and a resolution, so that each scene is essentially a short story in itself. Sometimes these problem/ resolution combinations may be carried over from or to other chapters, but they are assessed in a different light so as not to be redundant.

I also wish to emphasize that a conclusion for each scene does not necessarily equal a clean break; I have had situations in my own writing where a chapter is actually ended abruptly by a surprise intervention of dialogue (for a boring example, a messenger running up) or a physical confrontation/ attack. This can then segue into the next chapter rather easily, or the writer can take liberties here and jump around in time, which is probably both cruel and to my liking.

My only other immediate thought is this: make sure every scene and every chapter serve some purpose in developing character or advancing the plot of your story! If a particular section does neither, strongly consider eliminating or reworking it to make it satisfy one or both of the above requirements.

Other than that, it pains me to say that chapter and scene breaks should just "feel natural" to the author and do not necessarily call upon hard and fast rules in order to be properly executed. I am often reminded of Stephen King's The Shining for the simple reason that this lengthy book contains a very brief chapter (maybe only half a page or so) amidst a number of other chapters that consist of numerous pages.



Cheers,
WD

[chopper]

Originally Posted by Cyricus

How do you guys (who write similar type of chapters) separate the action, begin and end those separated "parts of the chapters" and its' actions/scenes?

i'll do this if the parts of the chapter are linked in some way. for example, one half deals with the Fifth of Ash, who is preparing to meet the other arriving Fifths. the other half deals with two of her stewards, who are up to their neck in shifty deals and really ought to be making their way to the ceremony.

or: one half has the Mark fleeing from armed pursuers, as seen from the Hero's POV. the other half then sees the pursuit from the POV of the leader of the pursuers.

point, and counterpoint. if you flip from one side of the story to another that is totally unconnected, i think you risk losing the reader. just my view, anyhow.

as for breaks in the action, they happen where they happen. they can be used artificially within a single POV to illustrate the passage of time.

if you write a plot synopsis (of 2 sides of typed A4), you should (not guaranteed ) be able to create a separate chapter for almost every sentence. (well, it's working for me at the moment, heh)

length of chapters? again, it stops when it stops. my writing style isn't going to give me many sub-5000 word chapters, so i don't worry too much about the length.

has that covered everything? ah -

chapter headings - i like em. pains to think of, but a good reminder of what i'm doing inside the chapter, and also makes any given point of the story easier to find as they're all saved individually on the PC.

[Lith]

Jumping around in space in the middle of a chapter can be fine, given a break mark, such as a *** or a location listing. It's something I've consciously avoided as a writer thus far, to simplify things. But as a reader I don't mind it.

I was halfway through my last manuscript when I started titling chapters, because I came up with a killer pun to describe one scene (well, a pun-rhyme THING), and having one chapter title, had to go back and title the rest of them. It was easier than I anticipated. They're all either puns or faintly ludicrous and pompous sounding, which fits very well with the off-kilter tone of the story. My current one is single-word chapter titles, to reflect the simplicity of the Old West, and each word doing double or triple duty in the meaning department. It'll come out to an ambiguous simplicity which I'll be rather proud of if I can make it work.

When I first started doing chapter titles, I did it purely for my own entertainment, and if it didn't work for some reason, I could take them out. In fact, I had planned to take half of them out, as the chapters are rather short otherwise. But soon I found it a good way to focus the beginning and end of each chapter.

The half-page chapter can be quite fun, if it's put in the right place and not over-indulged.

[power to the J]

The half page chapters is one of those things that you can only use once or twice or else it starts getting annoying. If chapter after chapter is that short, I personally start getting agitated (Don't ask why) so I avoid it when I'm writing like it's a plague.

[flynx]

In my second published short story (not f or s/f) these are the 'statistics'.

The book is slightly taller than the average paperback (about an inch taller than discworld paperbacks).

4000 words in MS Word. 8 MS Word pages. (ariel 10) which in the printed book makes 15 pages.

There are two page breaks of asterisks which could be called chapters I suppose.

The first is 173 words.
second 2,900
third 917

These breaks were all 'scene changes'.

I know Pratchett doesn't use actual chapters but he does have page breaks (a row of asterisks) and these are usually scene changes or plot switches.

In much the same way as readers don't like large blocks of text, in my opinion they also don't like having somewhere that they can read up to. Your reader (in the case of paragraphs) likes to be able to take a breath occasionally and (in the case of chapters) likes somewhere that they can put the book down or go make a pot of tea or just have a break from an enthralling roof-top chase. Bearing this in mind you have two ways for making chapters or just page breaks. One is to insert something relevant (plot switch) the other is to bring a section, like a roof top chase, an intimate moment or useful background for instance, to a close.

So as a rough guide a page of MS Word (5-600 words depending on paragraph length) is approximately equal to two paperback pages.

Chapters or page breaks are about equal to the length of a piece of string.