Robin Hobb's Assassin and Ethics

[hodor]

I can't argue with you there kelpie. I don't know how many time I had wanted to put down one of the three assassin books. Plus it took me an extremely long time to get throught the first series. I completely understand what you are saying.

[Alexa]

After reading all the posts, I really don't know what to say. I still have to read volume 9. Unfortunately, I have to wait for a slower reader to finish it. It really took me one day per volume. See how much I like it ? I imagine it's not easy to like it if you cannot "sink" into the plot since the beginning.

Fitz had suffered a lot and he was abused all his life. Still I find his character very interesting. And his connection with the wolf helps him to get out from very difficult situations. I didn't like very much the "forgisés" (sorry, I don't know the word in English as I read the French translation. I want to say those poor people left without souls after the meeting of pirates). Did I find the book depressing ? Hell, NO. I was all the time on " what happens next" influence.

Some of you are writers. Please tell me what do you expect once you get published from your readers ?

[Silk]

Originally Posted by Alexa

Did I find the book depressing ? Hell, NO. I was all the time on " what happens next" influence.

I was exactly the same; the assasin books & livership traiders were proberbly my biggest reading obsessions of last year - its only the second time I've read two series form the same author back-to-back, I normally prefer to have a bit of a rest in between.

[Fitz]

[quote=rune]Even though I knew Fitz was trained as an assassin, I never saw him as one. Most of the time he was portraid as a reluctant participant in this activity. [quote]
I think that's the reason that I never considered this ethical dillenma: I've never really considered him as an assassin, only a soldier who followed his orders.
And yes, the series does seem awfully depressing at times, but it's also interesting to see how he pulls through them.

[Teresa Edgerton]

Not sure what you mean, Alexa, about what writers expect from their readers. Do you mean sticking with a writer and a series after some disappointments?

[Alexa]

I want to know what reaction do you expect from a reader ? To get bored after a few pages ? I don't think so. To have characters without any charm around them ? No, I don't think that one either. To have a big book published, but nobody interested to read it. Nope. Do you understand what I mean ?

My point is, Robin Hobb has created a character (Fitz) who can touch the public. Fits is special, intriguing, romantic, courageous. Having a character like him can make you forget about the less strong parts of the book. I love to read. What do I expect to find into a good Book ? A good intrigue, interesting characters, something new to provoke my imagination, not to many boring descriptions, etc. Well, now that we are talking about, I remember Hobb repeted herself with some descriptions. Like she was afraid we could forget them going through all the volumes. I forget her about them, because of Fitz.

[dwndrgn]

Alexa - you've brought up a point that I've often expressed, if the character is so real that you can imaging sitting down in a bar/pub and having a pint with them, that is true writing. Fitz as a character is so well-rounded and so developed, you can imagine having a conversation with him. Definitely what I'd say was good writing.

As far as depressing, yes his life has a lot of down moments and I'm not one to celebrate depressing novels - I usually dislike them because reading is such an escape from that for me. But, the Assassin novels have that extra realism and touch to make them interesting even though they have that depressing bent to them.

[hodor]

I really appreciated the Liveship Traders and The Tawny Man far more than her first series. I did like the Farseer Trilogy, however I felt that her next two series were on a higher level.

[rune]

I would say Hobb is gifted in writing about misery. But for me this is what makes her characters so real. I actually felt for them, and when there is great loss (especially in the Tawny Man series) I was nearly crying.

Brilliant writing and brilliant books

[Alexa]

Originally Posted by dwndrgn

Alexa - you've brought up a point that I've often expressed, if the character is so real that you can imaging sitting down in a bar/pub and having a pint with them, that is true writing. Fitz as a character is so well-rounded and so developed, you can imagine having a conversation with him. Definitely what I'd say was good writing.

Sorry, I didn't know about that. I didn't have the time to read all the threads and I was almost afraid to look into this section of the forum when I saw writers posting in. Reading is an escape for me, too. Whenever I have a good book into my hands, I'm full of energy and happiness.

I hope I can find the trilogies of Hobb. I want them for my collection.

[Teresa Edgerton]

Ah, well then, Alexa, to answer your question: as a writer, I don't expect to please everyone. As a reader, I know that not everyone has the same tastes -- and that even some of my friends who have fairly similar tastes will sometimes recommend a book that I end up not liking at all, or will dislike a book that I was absolutely crazy about.

For instance, several people on these boards have stated that they don't like books with too much description. Well, it happens that I absolutely love a descriptive style of writing if it is particularly well done, and going by some of the books that others here have recommended, I would say that I am not alone. I love good characterization as well -- but just as you will forgive a certain amount of long-winded description for the sake of an interesting character, I will occasionally forgive a book that is somewhat light on characterization if the prose absolutely blows me away. Of course the books I love most have both qualities. Everyone has their own list of likes and dislikes, and their own way of prioritizing them.

So when I sit down to write, I try to do the best possible job of writing the kind of book that I, personally, like to read. And if I am happy with what I have written, I hope (expect is too strong a word, because who am I to have expectations of people I may not even know?) that those who share many of my tastes as a reader will be interested enough and delighted enough to keep on reading.

But to return to Robin Hobb: I agree that she does what she does particularly well. So well in some aspects, in fact, that I was willing to stick with her all through the first Farseer book, in spite of the things that weren't to my personal taste (the somewhat gimmicky names and the heavy dose of despair). I think her world-building is exceptional, and I really like her prose style which is both eloquent and easy to read (but not distinctive enough for me to absolutely fall in love with). I thought Fitz was a sympathetic and interesting character, and I was intrigued by some of his moral and ethical dilemmas. In the end, though, the weight of gloom and doom was too much for me -- which is a personal observation, not a value judgement.

[Alexa]

Thanks a lot, Kelpie. I hope to have the chance one day to read one of your books.

[Teresa Edgerton]

The opportunity is already before you, Alexa. My book was published in October.

But while I think you might really like my characters (who spend most of the book in increasingly dire circumstances, and yet grit their teeth and go on) there is no getting around the fact that I do employ a descriptive style.

(You see how difficult it is for me to recommend anything, even the product of my own blood, sweat, and tears, without a disclaimer of some sort.)

We now return the conversation to Fitz and the questions of ethics and morality he is obliged to face.

For me, a large part of what made those questions interesting and believable was the context. Which brings us back to the author's abilities at worldbuilding. Within his world, his culture, his time, his own particular background, I can sympathize with Fitz and the decisions he makes (even when I don't necessarily agree with them) -- but I would be horrified at the same behavior in, say, my next-door-neighbor.

[Alexa]

You mean "The hidden stars"? I'll do my best to find it. You know, unfortunately the Canadians are not so quick in some domains. Anyway, I hope my book club can help me find it.

I'll be worried too, the day when my next-door-neighbor have a telepathic connection with a wolf.

Anyway, the slower reader at my library was supposed to return volum 9 by today. He didn't ! I hope he doesn't need another 3 weeks to finish it. I'm eager to find out how this adventure ends.

[Lidora]

for me, all of hobb's trilogies, particularly those concerning fitz, were made incredible by how deep the relationships between her characters went. the friendship between fitz and the fool is incredible, amazing, so much depth. it's the kind of relationship with a person i can only imagine having. i felt for those charcters, sympathized and cared for them. for an author to be able to do that is truly a gift.


robin hobb's novels are tragic. much as some of the best literature in history is tragic. crime and punishment, hamlet, and so on. this does not mean that one should regard them in distaste. i was actually quite pleased that hobb didn't take the predictable route and end it on an up note (farseer trilogy).

SPOILER FOR TAWNY MAN FOOL'S FATE FOLLOWS:






actually, to tell you the truth, i was disappointed that fitz ended up with molly. it made burrich's death seem more of a plot device rather than an attempt to bring out the emotion of fitz losing his father figure. also, the end of tawny man seemed all to much of a happily every after. although, i understand that since fitz and the fool completed their roles as the prophet and catalyst that they no longer had to be tragic, i was still a little thrown. and then, the one thing that i would have liked didn't happen. the fool left. so sad. i loved the fool, favorite character by far. i wanted to see him with fitz, i wanted the fool to be a woman and for fitz and the fool to be together.


SPOILER FOR LIVESHIP TRADER:

and also, not all of hobb's trilogies end so depressing. liveship traders ended on a very pleasant note and it didn't feel like anything was sacrificed to end it that way.


anyhow, i love hobb's work, i prize it among some of the best fantasy literature i've read.