Jaqen H'ghar

[Shacklock]

Originally Posted by pan naranus

another theory that I heard is that jaqen is syrio forel. If you believe it you know exactly how he got to the black cells.
syrio background suits well into the cover of a faceless (nobody know where eddard found him, but he is bravossi). it allows for his weapon skill, his interest in arya and for that cut in his death scene, we don't actually know if he died (or for that matter hurt his finger).
So you conspiracy masters, what do you make of it?

Ah but Syrio was the Sealord's champion (I forgot the exact title for the Lord and the Champion but meh) So, he dident exactly appear out of nowhere. And if he was a Faceless Man I doubt he'd have such training as a Waterdancer, although not so sure what combat training Faceless Men exactly recieve.
Anyway Jaqen said he was Lorathi, not Bravosi, which admitedly doesent mean much when he's a guy that can change his appereance.

[TK-421]

Here's your trout slap of the day:

Jaqen=Syrio??? Haven't heard that one before!!!

ASOIAF Theory...

Syrio

[viZion]

I never liked the Syrio = Jaqen theories. The evidence presented is never solid and requires some major jumps to make the connections. I actually hope it's not true since I like the thought of Syrio and Jaqen being their own people since they are both interesting and dynamic characters.

A lot of theories seem to be invented because people just really don't want to believe certain characters can be dead. If we try hard enough we can probably come up with a theory stating that Eddard is still alive even though half of King's Landing saw his head chopped off.

[pan naranus]

Originally Posted by viZion

A lot of theories seem to be invented because people just really don't want to believe certain characters can be dead. If we try hard enough we can probably come up with a theory stating that Eddard is still alive even though half of King's Landing saw his head chopped off.

In my opinion the case of Syrio calls for the assumption he is not dead after all. Why else did martin conceal his death so bluntly?
a question then. can you find any evidence as to the fate of Syrio? Who was the white shield that tried to arrest him? is there any talk in kinglanding or bravos over his death? Do we know for certain he actually was first sword for the sea lords? is it possible to be first sword and a faceless man? if the theory is correct, do you fined any pattern in the activities of the faceless in westerose? (The death of balon grejoy, syrio open life in kinglanding (is there any evidence to a secret life?), jaquin hagars actions in harrenhall and in the service of the brave companions and the most recent secret invasion of the citedeil. another question that comes to mind, was ariya recruitment planed by the faceless of by higher power (a.k.a grrrm)

[viZion]

Syrio may very well be alive but Syrio = Jaqen is just one theory I won't ever believe until it's proven in the books themselves. It's just too sketchy right now.

[JDP]

The fact that we don't actually see Syrio die doesn't mean that he must be alive; the chapter was written from Arya's POV, so we leave the action when she does. I don't think he's alive.

[TK-421]

I have reflected on this because I too did find Syrio's death "offscreen" somewhat suspect. But, being the type of character Syrio was, I think his death was fitting and for GRRM to have graphically put it in the books, may not be suitable to Syrio. Don't know, but just trying to make sense of it I guess.

[Boaz]

Regarding Syrio's encounter with Ser Meryn of the Kingsguard...

First, Ser Meryn survived. Syrio killed or wounded five Red Cloaks, but not Meryn.

Second, Syrio sent Arya away. If Syrio planned on killing Meryn and escorting Arya to safety, then he'd have killed Meryn. Meryn survived.

Mayhaps, Syrio ran away from Meryn. But remember, Syrion tut-tutted Arya and said something like, "The first sword of Braavos does not run."

So Syrio and Meryn faced off with weapons. Syrio would not run. Meryn survived. I think the conclusion is that Ser Meryn chopped Syrio into many pieces.

[Shacklock]

Originally Posted by Boaz

Regarding Syrio's encounter with Ser Meryn of the Kingsguard...

First, Ser Meryn survived. Syrio killed or wounded five Red Cloaks, but not Meryn.

Second, Syrio sent Arya away. If Syrio planned on killing Meryn and escorting Arya to safety, then he'd have killed Meryn. Meryn survived.

Mayhaps, Syrio ran away from Meryn. But remember, Syrion tut-tutted Arya and said something like, "The first sword of Braavos does not run."

So Syrio and Meryn faced off with weapons. Syrio would not run. Meryn survived. I think the conclusion is that Ser Meryn chopped Syrio into many pieces.

Meryn was wearing full-plate I think? And although Syrio only had a stick I wouldent think a Knight encumbered in full-plate could kill the dude that just killed five Red-Cloaks with a stick xD

[JDP]

Originally Posted by Shacklock

I wouldent think a Knight encumbered in full-plate could kill the dude that just killed five Red-Cloaks with a stick xD

I think it's way more likely that a guy in full plate with a sword could kill a guy with a stick than vice versa

Plus, I don't reckon a Knight of the Kingsguard would be 'encumbered' by their armour -- that's how they do battle.

[Shacklock]

Originally Posted by JDP

I think it's way more likely that a guy in full plate and a sword could kill a guy with a stick than vice versa

Plus, I don't reckon a Knight of the Kingsguard would be 'encumbered' by their armour -- that's how they do battle.

To be fair, everyone that wears Heavy-Plate moves slowly. I'm pretty sure such a Skilled-Water dancer could repeat the tactitcs Bronn used in the Eyrie, or at least something simmilair.
That is, dancing around and out of the narrow view the Knight has.

[Boaz]

Shack, but Syrio said he would not run away and we know that Meryn survived. So are you suggesting that Meryn got tired and left? Is Syrio still upstairs waiting for someone to take him on?

Syrio was fast... to Arya. But we see him unable to get his wooden sword out of Meryn's way. Meryn chopped Syrio's stick to pieces. I think Syrio was next.

Granted, we don't see what happened, but it'll take a lot of evidence to convince me that Syrio somehow survived that encounter.

[Shacklock]

Originally Posted by Boaz

Shack, but Syrio said he would not run away and we know that Meryn survived. So are you suggesting that Meryn got tired and left? Is Syrio still upstairs waiting for someone to take him on?

Syrio was fast... to Arya. But we see him unable to get his wooden sword out of Meryn's way. Meryn chopped Syrio's stick to pieces. I think Syrio was next.

Granted, we don't see what happened, but it'll take a lot of evidence to convince me that Syrio somehow survived that encounter.

Yea me too, but he could have grabbed a sword from one of the dead guys, knocked Meryn out somehow. Etc.
Granted, he probably is dead. I'm just arguing the other side.

[Boaz]

Originally Posted by Shacklock

I'm just arguing the other side.

I like to do that too.

Hey, I've been convinced to switch positions on ASOIAF almost as many times as Hilary Clinton's switched her position on Iraq. So if you give me some good evidence, I'll reconsider Syrio. Heck, even if you don't I may switch positions tomorrow anyway.

[TK-421]

Unless, Meryn recognized Syrio, knew who he was, didn't want to die, and gave him the chance to escape to Varys...