Does anybody actually enjoy these books? (Spoilers)

[Durandal]

Originally Posted by C Of K

I believe most people blame Jordan, not so much for writing a bad story, as much as they do because he changed the pacing. Even RJ admitted that some methods he employed in his story didn't work so well as he would have liked. Art and writing are often experimental.

There are many series out there that are all about plots and plotting, ASOIAF for example, but WoT didn't start out that way. It can only be expected that many people that enjoyed the beginning, wouldn't necessarily like recent developments.

Had RJ started the series off, writing as he did in the last few volumes, his fans would have grown to love it because of that style. Fewer people would have been disillusioned by the changes in pace, although he may have had a number of different fans.

You'll find that musical artists are often like this. Throughout their careers their interests often change. It's up to the fans that were there in the beginning, and the ones who come along later on to define the popularity of such artists. Good and bad are just a point of view in this respect. With art, such classifications will always be subjective, and people will always rate it as one or the other.

The pace of the first few books is largely part of what made WoT popular to begin with. Robert Jordan became the leading author in High Fantasy because of the beginning of his series. Would he still hold that position if Eye of the World had been written more like Crossroads of Twilight? Or would WoT have been more enjoyable had it not changed pace so drastically? I think fans consider these things when they decide whether or not RJ's last couple books are either good or bad. The number of hardcore fans he has right now might actually reflect how things may have turned out for him.

Oh, and welcome, Daenerys! The Dragon has three heads.

Well said. The analogy of music artists is pretty apt, I think. Nearly any writer's style will evolve over time, and one of the troubles in taking on a massive series (the writing of which will span multiple decades) is that the author will likely not be the same writer s/he was at the outset.

As for me, I like the WoT. I've read them up through Path of Daggers, then decided to wait until the series wraps up (or, I suppose, the announcement is made that it won't) before reading the rest. You know, I might even re-read the whole series if Memory of Light comes out -- that's just how much I don't dislike this series.

[Rawled Demha]

Originally Posted by Durandal

You know, I might even re-read the whole series if Memory of Light comes out -- that's just how much I don't dislike this series.

thats me as well!

[C Of K]

Welcome, Durandal. Here's to hoping that it is finished. There are a lot of browns here at Chronicles that would likely love to reread WoT when/if it is ever finished.

[Commonmind]

Originally Posted by C Of K

I believe most people blame Jordan, not so much for writing a bad story, as much as they do because he changed the pacing. Even RJ admitted that some methods he employed in his story didn't work so well as he would have liked. Art and writing are often experimental.

There are many series out there that are all about plots and plotting, ASOIAF for example, but WoT didn't start out that way. It can only be expected that many people that enjoyed the beginning, wouldn't necessarily like recent developments.

Had RJ started the series off, writing as he did in the last few volumes, his fans would have grown to love it because of that style. Fewer people would have been disillusioned by the changes in pace, although he may have had a number of different fans.

You'll find that musical artists are often like this. Throughout their careers their interests often change. It's up to the fans that were there in the beginning, and the ones who come along later on to define the popularity of such artists. Good and bad are just a point of view in this respect. With art, such classifications will always be subjective, and people will always rate it as one or the other.

The pace of the first few books is largely part of what made WoT popular to begin with. Robert Jordan became the leading author in High Fantasy because of the beginning of his series. Would he still hold that position if Eye of the World had been written more like Crossroads of Twilight? Or would WoT have been more enjoyable had it not changed pace so drastically? I think fans consider these things when they decide whether or not RJ's last couple books are either good or bad. The number of hardcore fans he has right now might actually reflect how things may have turned out for him.

Oh, and welcome, Daenerys! The Dragon has three heads.

Agreed. My point was that he changed pace as he saw fit. I don't believe it was so drastic, however, but more of a gradual change, one that had become so much slower that between books five and seven some fans no longer enjoyed reading them. In a way the same thing happened to me, the first few books were page turners. As the series progressed I had to start getting myself in a Jordan mood to pick them up and read. That's not to say I enjoyed them any less, they're just different experiences than the beginning of the series; yet still, as I mentioned above, they're very much Jordan novels and I know what I'm getting myself into when I open one up.

[C Of K]

Too right. He has always been very Jordan-esque. No one could write quite like him. A sad truth, mind you. Still I hope for a finish to the series.

[BSOM180]

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride. We'll see things through eventually. I do have an odd note though, I was re-reading book 4 and there was a chapter that Nynaeve didn't pull on that big braid of hers, it said she pulled on a bunch of small braids. I always assumed nynaeve had a thick weave braid, but the way it described it in this chapter was as though she had tons of braids and she would grab them all together. I was wondering if there was a reason for the difference, if she had changed her appearance or if Jordan just forgot how he usually wrote it? Or did I just misinterpret it from the beginning??

[murphy]

Originally Posted by BSOM180

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride. We'll see things through eventually. I do have an odd note though, I was re-reading book 4 and there was a chapter that Nynaeve didn't pull on that big braid of hers, it said she pulled on a bunch of small braids. I always assumed nynaeve had a thick weave braid, but the way it described it in this chapter was as though she had tons of braids and she would grab them all together. I was wondering if there was a reason for the difference, if she had changed her appearance or if Jordan just forgot how he usually wrote it? Or did I just misinterpret it from the beginning??

If I'm not mistaken, that occurred when she was in Tanchico and that was the way the women in that city wore their hair, and she, Nynaeve, was following the fashion. Especially in the daring dresses they wore.

[BSOM180]

Yep, I was reading the next book and it came across a part where she mentioned having her hair back in the wrist-thick braid. Thanks much ^.^

[Esioul]

I'm trying to read the first book at the moment, but struggling. So far not much has happened, and what has happened has been so generic and predictable... gah.

[Tansy]

I enjoyed the first few so much I bought up book 10 I think but gave halfway through book 8.. I think, maybe 9. I occasionally think I'd like to know how it ends but can't make myself read them again.

Maybe one day

[wook-bot5000]

I still enjoy the series, and look forward to the last book (just so the circle is complete).
I can recall when the first few books came out being amazed by RJ's writing style and his amazing land and cultures. I stilll believe that his vision of Randland (if whatever people like to call it) is unique and possibly one of the most complex and well thought out (apart from the master JRRT). However there have been authors of late who have a more pared back approach who excite me more. But at the end of the day. it is still an epic series, and has earned its place in modern fantasy. I cant however wait for it to be finally over after so many years! Half my life has been spent reading and waiting for this series!

[Tickle]

Yes, I like this series. I started it back in the late 90's and I'm also waiting on the final book. I love the different characters, although some do get on my nerves, and what they are going thru. I don't like how some of the later books dragged on, but I still read them and once the final book is out, I will probably re-read the entire series since it has been so long since I read the first ones.

The WOT series will definetly be in my bookcase.

[Clansman]

I have liked the series on the whole. I started with The Eye of the World back in 1990, and waited for each volume to come out.

However, by the time book 7 came along, the story got a little lost. Not badly, but enough off the track that it was like you kept turning pages, saying, "okay, who are you and what have you done with RJ?"

I don't necessarily agree about the stylistic changes. I think some story lines were included that would have been better treated as one-shot novels that could have been released (like New Spring) in between the major volumes, or totally ignored. I'm sorry, but the story of Perrin chasing after Fayle and the Shaido Aiel should have been cut out all together, and the books could have been otherwise substantially compressed. The series should have been wrapped up in 8 books, not twelve. Then, certain story lines could have been released as prequels or sequels or as additional stories (Stephen Donaldson did this with a whole chunk of story from the Covenant books in his book of stories, Daughter of Regals).

As an author, one must have some respect for one's audience. Not that RJ didn't, he just got a little forgetful, imho. As a contrast, Terry Goodkind has no respect for his readers at all. Just read his interviews. The arrogance comes shining through.

I am very glad to know that WOT will be finished. Brandon Sanderson will write the final volume, A Memory of Light, based on RJ's outline and rather extensive notes. Risky thing for Mr. Sanderson. It will either make or break his career. I see no middle ground.

[murphy]

Originally Posted by Clansman

(snip)


I am very glad to know that WOT will be finished. Brandon Sanderson will write the final volume, A Memory of Light, based on RJ's outline and rather extensive notes. Risky thing for Mr. Sanderson. It will either make or break his career. I see no middle ground.

I have to disagree with that. Sanderson has written 3 books so far that are pretty good and have gotten some good reviews. Have you read any of them? Elantris was his first and he has finished two books in the Mistborn series all of which are pretty good reads.

[Clansman]

I agree that Sanderson is a good writer, at least by repute (I have not yet had the opportunity to read his stuff, but I want to).

My point was that taking this story to conclusion after 11 novels were written by such a successful and beloved writer is, by its very nature, risky. If it doesn't quite come off (and that might be completely RJ's fault), Sanderson will take the fall. If it comes off really well, Sanderson stands to gain a great deal of readers from the legions of RJ fans.

However, I could be just opining hot air. I am reminded of Gandalf's famous line "Even the very wise do not see all ends...", or something like that.