The message of the matrix..

[Rawled Demha]

anyone got any ideas?

the ending left me highly unsatisfied until the other day, when it occurred to me - what happens to the people still plugged into the matirx? neo secures peace with machinekind, but i doubt the machines were willing to give up their batteries for peace from a war they were already winning.

im really sorry to be a pest, but i didnt see the Matrix section in the featured films....im sure it would get a lot more replies there....

[Foxbat]

I don't think there is any message in The Matrix. If you check interviews at the time with the directors, they admit that it's reason for being is 'Kung Fu versus computers'.

It's only after they realised what a success they had on their hands that they got all pretentious and quasi-religous in the two sequels.

Take the first film for what it is - a chance to cheer the good guys whilst munching popcorn. The sequels? A waste of time.

[Foxbat]

Oh yes. I forgot to mention. I've moved this to the Matrix section in films

[kythe]

Originally Posted by Foxbat

I don't think there is any message in The Matrix. If you check interviews at the time with the directors, they admit that it's reason for being is 'Kung Fu versus computers'.

Really? Here is Keanu Reeves on the intended trilogy:
IGN: Interview with Keanu Reeves

The directors intended it to be philosophical:
http://http://www.cleave.com/Sight/T.../wachowski.htm

The film grew out of the brothers' longtime fascination (since they were teen-agers) with ideas that challenge current perceptions of reality. They said they were also intrigued by the way mythology and the Internet informed culture.

"The script was a synthesis of ideas that sort of came together at a moment when we were interested in a lot of things: making mythology relevant in a modern context, relating quantum physics to Zen Buddhism, investigating your own life," said Andy

The Wachowski's tried incorporating archetypes into a cyberpunk world, but it wasn't coherent enough, It tried to be all-encompassing rather than send a specific message. Star Wars (the original, at least) did well at creating a mythology, following the archetypal hero's journey. The Matrix trilogy made a high-tech attempt at the same concept, but didn't really pull though.

Back to the original subject:

I can only think of two possible explanations for the ending. One is that everyone woke up to a changed world where they were free to choose whether to stay in it or go to the real world. Basically, its The Matrix without agents or any other safeguards. The other possibility is that everyone died since they were taken over by the multiple Smiths. The machines would certainly have new "crops" about to ripen and could start over with a new group of plugged in humans. Either option leaves the question of how long this can continue before the machines need an additional power source.

I believe the machines probably already had better options for battery power, especially in anticipation for something like this. The *real* reason they kept humans plugged in was to subdue them and keep them from becoming a threat to the machines, not really because they needed that source of energy. Once Neo sacrificed himself for a truce, the entire Matrix was no longer needed. It may have still been wanted though, by those who did not wish to live in the harsh real world. Thus, the "choice".

[Joel007]

At the end, people were free to enter or leave the matrix by choice. some preferred to stay inside.

[Rawled Demha]

Originally Posted by Joel007

At the end, people were free to enter or leave the matrix by choice. some preferred to stay inside.

i dont think this was so...the peace neo negotiatied was between the humans already out of the matrix and the machines. they effectively abandoned those still in the matrix. this was what really struck me the other day, that basically, those humans not free of the matrix were left to stew.

neo went from fighting the machines for all humanity to fighting smith for the machines and those select humans outside the matrix. although this is not the happiest of endings, i did feel it to be more appropriate, when i understood it. it was more 'realisitic'...

[Anastasia]

The message of The Matrix? Just because you can make a ground-breaking, one-off movie on a restricted budget, doesn't mean the sequels will be any good, even if you chuck loads of money at them.

The Matrix is a prime example that a great idea isn't necessarily improved by providing more of it.

[Rawled Demha]

in what way does the matrix fall short in your view ana?

[Anastasia]

Originally Posted by Rawled Demha

in what way does the matrix fall short in your view ana?

Where do I start?

The original movie was spectacular in my humble opinion. I loved it, and I loved the fact that it didn't tell us everything - it left some room for imagination and speculation.

However, they brought out the first sequel and we were hopeful, against hope, that it might be almost as good. It wasn't awful. It just wasn't that good. It created a lot of unanswered questions: who was the Architect? Who was the Oracle? How could Neo produce electricity bolts in the 'real world' as well as in the Matrix? Who were the Merivingions and why? There was too much stuff to go into now, but a lot of the plot was a mystery (and not in a good way).

So we fans waited for the final movie and hurried along to the cinema when it came out, hoping that all these loose ends would be tied off and there would be some kind of over-arching explanation to justify all the mysteries of the second movie. I can tell you, I have read so many wonderful fan-fics and speculations which would tie up everything, following the second movie, but sadly none of these fans were employed as script-writers.

Unfortunately, the plot of the third movie, such as it was (repetitive, non-sensical, largely pointless) didn't even attempt to answer the questions or come up with cunning solutions. It just ignored anything that was inconvenient, and replaced it with spectacular CGIs and interesting stunts.

I'm sorry, but you can stick your CGIs and stunts if the story sucks, and the story did suck (unlike the story of the first Matrix). The problem with Hollywood these days is that no one tells a great story any more - with a good, strong beginning, middle and end. And a point. What was the point of the two sequels? What story was left to tell? Or was it a cynical attempt to milk more money out of Matrix fans?

[andrew.v.spencer]

The message of the matrix is yythobbbk!!!\\\\\\\\\|||{SJUB}BHB99910101010010010 01010100101001001000000000100100010000100011

OVERMIND NOTE: AGENT SPENCER IS INDISPOSED.

[Rawled Demha]

Originally Posted by Anastasia

However, they brought out the first sequel and we were hopeful, against hope, that it might be almost as good. It wasn't awful. It just wasn't that good. It created a lot of unanswered questions: who was the Architect? Who was the Oracle? How could Neo produce electricity bolts in the 'real world' as well as in the Matrix? Who were the Merivingions and why? There was too much stuff to go into now, but a lot of the plot was a mystery (and not in a good way).

So we fans waited for the final movie and hurried along to the cinema when it came out, hoping that all these loose ends would be tied off and there would be some kind of over-arching explanation to justify all the mysteries of the second movie. I can tell you, I have read so many wonderful fan-fics and speculations which would tie up everything, following the second movie, but sadly none of these fans were employed as script-writers.

Unfortunately, the plot of the third movie, such as it was (repetitive, non-sensical, largely pointless) didn't even attempt to answer the questions or come up with cunning solutions. It just ignored anything that was inconvenient, and replaced it with spectacular CGIs and interesting stunts.

I'm sorry, but you can stick your CGIs and stunts if the story sucks, and the story did suck (unlike the story of the first Matrix). The problem with Hollywood these days is that no one tells a great story any more - with a good, strong beginning, middle and end. And a point. What was the point of the two sequels? What story was left to tell? Or was it a cynical attempt to milk more money out of Matrix fans?

i never thought of it that way, i waited till i could get all three on dvd (good copies )

i can see how it left a lot of questions unanswered and just reading your post from way back when, has actually aroused some anger in me, in that i overlooked these factors.

but you seem to be saying that you're unhappy with the third because it didnt tell you what you want to know. if you approach a film (especially films in series) with this kind of mentality, you will invariably be disappointed. you have to look at what they film-makers wanted you to know, and then you start to appreciate it better.

we have answers to you questions, but they are admittedly very brief. the merovingian (one person) was an old program that did something else. he ( i assume) was an exile who gathered other exiles and forged his own empire in the matrix. likewise the oracle and the architect were programs.

neo shot lightning, because "the power of the one extends beyond this world" a quote from the oracle whilst in the matrix.

[Dave]

Originally Posted by andrew.v.spencer

The message of the matrix is yythobbbk!!!\\\\\\\\\|||{SJUB}BHB99910101010010010 01010100101001001000000000100100010000100011

OVERMIND NOTE: AGENT SPENCER IS INDISPOSED.

EXEC SQL WHENEVER

Humans are all prisoners and that the tangible world is our cave. The things which we perceive as real are actually just shadows on a wall. Just as the escaped prisoner ascends into the light of the sun, we amass knowledge and ascend into the light of true reality: ideas in the mind, the form of the Good.

That's not about the Matrix Trilogy, but from Wikipedia about Plato's allegory of the Cave. It does sum up the films neatly though.

Originally Posted by Rawled Demha

The peace Neo negotiated was between the humans already out of the matrix and the machines. They effectively abandoned those still in the matrix. This was what really struck me the other day, that basically, those humans not free of the matrix were left to stew...

Not at all, many people are happy living without the truth. They actively deny the truth because it is too hard to conceive that it might be true. While other people, once they have tasted the truth cannot go back again. They are clever men those Wachowski brothers!

Of course, it's all a load of philosophical ******** really!

[sarakoth]

Neo did the best he could. The machines wouldn't have settled for anything more.