Lovecraftian Odes

[ghyle]

I have started a small series of odes about and in honour of HPL. Who here would like to read and, if possible, give feedback on them. For the most part, the poems are going to be non-horrific: it is the person, not the works, that shall be the primary focus, and I have limited myself, for the most part, to Hellenic forms of the ode as well. So that, although most do not rhyme, they retain a formalist pattern rather than a vers libre one.

[Ningauble]

Originally Posted by ghyle

I have started a small series of odes about and in honour of HPL. Who here would like to read and, if possible, give feedback on them. For the most part, the poems are going to be non-horrific: it is the person, not the works, that shall be the primary focus, and I have limited myself, for the most part, to Hellenic forms of the ode as well. So that, although most do not rhyme, they retain a formalist pattern rather than a vers libre one.

I'm for it, ghyle; you know I like your poetry.

[j. d. worthington]

Well, Phillip, I'd be very interested, though I've not been nearly as prompt in dealing with things the last 2-3 weeks as I've normally been, things being what they are.... However, if you don't mind a somewhat slower response....

[HardScienceFan]

Count me in.I love poetry.
Plus,I'm simply curious.
Like JD:expect no speedy answers,will do my darnedest,however.

[ghyle]

Here's the first one. I hope you'll enjoy it.


We a dust of the salt dissolved in the all oceans, the turn
of a leaf on the winds of autumns all numberless, cast
to unheedingness, earth of soil that the feet beat in their dance.


Shall the immense elements dance their dance thus unquenchingly?


We arena of earths, we omphalos--turn earths as the core
be forgotten. Remember never the thinned axis, that weight
and that vastness have made to nothing but dust? Dust and a dream.


Shall the immense elements dream their dream thus unquenchingly?


Has the dream uncorrupted, fire and a fire worked, or has ash
in the hands of the moulder made us? O, look back on our days
and if shame the result, in questionless flame work and refine.


Shall the immense elements dance their dance thus unquenchingly?


If you image this image--smelters of steels vast and beyond
comprehension, unheeding cruibles vast, towering tall,
we a dance of the dust in sunlight, a shaft easily quenched.


Shall the immense elements fire their fire thus unquenchingly?


And the shimmering heat that rises, us dust stirs; as the tides
will the dust of the salt dissolved. And the bright columns of light,
shall they smelterwards smite? O dust in this heat dance--as a leaf!


Shall the immense elements dance their dance thus unquenchingly?


As a star in the grip of galaxy cast forthwards we dance--
if a star be thus caught, what dust we defies forces as vast?
If a star, then what dust defies these immense tides of no sea?


Shall the immense elements tide their tide thus unquenchingly?


And the stars in their dance no choices they make, voicing no voice,
no volition display, for well or for ill, dance as do dance
in the breezes the leaves, in columns of light dust, as decreed.


Shall the immense elements dance their dance thus unquenchingly?


These decrees are by laws enforced. Not by laws human and hollow,
but by natural laws, by physical laws, chemical laws,
that but govern both dust and element, make dance each their dance.


Shall the immense elements follow laws thus unquenchingly?


Thus decrees does the weird all things--it has brought everything thus--
both the dust and lance of light, and the tides, breezes and leaves--
thus decrees by its laws the weird--for the dance the weird has decreed.


Shall the immense elements dance their dance thus unquenchingly?


As the dancers thus dance, as weird has decreed, dust must be cast
as the seed from the seasons' birth; shall we seed broadcast be vain
for our season and fight the tide, and the sea's measure of dance?


Shall the immense elements beat their beat thus unquenchingly?


Shall my heart in revolt be vain? Let us dust henceforth accept
that such tides we may never fight nor defy, given that star
will alike us but die, and dance as we dance, due to the weird.


Shall the immense elements dance their dance thus unquenchingly?

[j. d. worthington]

Very good, Phillip. This one is going to take some thought to get everything said, I think. However, I'll raise a couple of points that struck me for you to consider:

Originally Posted by ghyle

We a dust of the salt dissolved in the all oceans, the turn

I assume that was transposed, and should be "all the oceans"?

Has the dream uncorrupted, fire and a fire worked, or has ash
in the hands of the moulder made us? O, look back on our days
and if shame the result, in questionless flame work and refine.


Shall the immense elements dance their dance thus unquenchingly?


If you image this image--smelters of steels vast and beyond
comprehension, unheeding cruibles vast, towering tall,
we a dance of the dust in sunlight, a shaft easily quenched.


Shall the immense elements fire their fire thus unquenchingly?

Again, I assume that should be "crucibles". And I will admit that "fire their fire" might more fittingly apply to the verse above -- but the structure demands it be here, and with the imagery of smelters, crucibles, etc., it does fit... but perhaps less immediately in mental association, where with the verse above it seems more closely allied.

As a star in the grip of galaxy cast forthwards we dance--
if a star be thus caught, what dust we defies forces as vast?
If a star, then what dust defies these immense tides of no sea?

"what dust we defies forces as vast" -- "defy" seems more appropriate here, unless I'm completely misreading the line; else it doesn't seem to make sense...

Shall my heart in revolt be vain? Let us dust henceforth accept
that such tides we may never fight nor defy, given that star
will alike us but die, and dance as we dance, due to the weird.

"alike" -- something like this demanded by structure again, but -- again -- I feel it doesn't fit... it makes the archaism overly artificial, and pulls the reader out of the cadence, I think. This may be a case where it would be better to simply have "like" for the sake of the whole....

One thing -- about the use of the word "omphalos"... I'm torn on that one, as it is the perfect word in some ways, with the connotations it bears; yet it seems slightly at odds with the diction of the rest of the piece; a bit more formal and archaic in tone, perhaps.... That's just the way it strikes me. However, I'm not sure how -- aside from recasting that entire set -- you'd get across not only the same thought, but the same nuances of meaning, using another word.

At any rate, it's a very powerful piece, I think; though it is a bit more intellectual in appeal, more metaphysical and less emotional, somewhat less accessible, than the other piece you've shown here. I'm not sure that's even a complaint -- rather an observation or comparison...

[ghyle]

Thank you immensely, JD, I appreciate the thought and consideration that you have put into addressing this. A note: the rhythm and mater do affect the diction at places, as you may have gathered.

Originally Posted by j. d. worthington

I assume that was transposed, and should be "all the oceans"?

I had intended to use oceans as a metaphor, as in every universe in the multiverse is an ocean, and we are but as specks of dust floating in them, and at their mercy. But "all the oceans works, after all, despite losing the metaphor. What are your thoughts?

Again, I assume that should be "crucibles".

Yes.

And I will admit that "fire their fire" might more fittingly apply to the verse above -- but the structure demands it be here, and with the imagery of smelters, crucibles, etc., it does fit... but perhaps less immediately in mental association, where with the verse above it seems more closely allied.

I had a moment of difficulty; "smelt" would just have not worked.

"what dust we defies forces as vast" -- "defy" seems more appropriate here, unless I'm completely misreading the line; else it doesn't seem to make sense...

There is an implied verb here: "what dust we [are] defies". Dust is singular, of course, and takes "defies".

"alike" -- something like this demanded by structure again, but -- again -- I feel it doesn't fit... it makes the archaism overly artificial, and pulls the reader out of the cadence, I think. This may be a case where it would be better to simply have "like" for the sake of the whole....

I can understand your point, however the main arguments for "alike" are: 1) it is a doublet word for like, and changing it alters the ratio of that doublet, altering the ratio in my writing; 2) the unstressed vowel serves to keep the 'l' sounds apart, and that is deliberate; 3) metrical and rhythmical demands require the two initial unstressed syllables there.

One thing -- about the use of the word "omphalos"... I'm torn on that one, as it is the perfect word in some ways, with the connotations it bears; yet it seems slightly at odds with the diction of the rest of the piece; a bit more formal and archaic in tone, perhaps.... That's just the way it strikes me. However, I'm not sure how -- aside from recasting that entire set -- you'd get across not only the same thought, but the same nuances of meaning, using another word.

For those not aware, the Hellenic word omphalos means navel; it was applied to the circular stone over which the Delphic priestess sat and delivered her oracles. So I wanted that level of Classical connotation, reflecting in part HPL's classicism, albeit his affected more by Rome than Greece.

[j. d. worthington]

Originally Posted by ghyle

I had intended to use oceans as a metaphor, as in every universe in the multiverse is an ocean, and we are but as specks of dust floating in them, and at their mercy. But "all the oceans works, after all, despite losing the metaphor. What are your thoughts?

My thoughts on that one is that it may be a bit too obscure a reference ("every universe in the multiverse" as an ocean, that is). The "all ocean" (singular) might get it across, but I'm not sure of that... Perhaps if "all" were capitalised, it might get it across, though....

I had a moment of difficulty; "smelt" would just have not worked.

I'm definitely in agreement there... my quibble (and it is a minor one) is that "fire" itself seemed more appropriate to the previous lines, rather than where it is placed, simply because it is more immediately linked associationally to those lines. However, as noted, the structure demands otherwise, so this was just an impression thrown out for what it was worth.

There is an implied verb here: "what dust we [are] defies". Dust is singular, of course, and takes "defies".

Actually, I'd argue that "dust" in this case is plural: "fine particles", or "infinitesimal motes"; especially as reinforced by "we", "us", etc. How it struck me was "what dust we [who] defy", or, stated slightly differently: "what dust [are] we [who] defy", hence my suggestion.

I can understand your point, however the main arguments for "alike" are: 1) it is a doublet word for like, and changing it alters the ratio of that doublet, altering the ratio in my writing; 2) the unstressed vowel serves to keep the 'l' sounds apart, and that is deliberate; 3) metrical and rhythmical demands require the two initial unstressed syllables there.

Yes, I'd taken all that into account... my only complaint is that use of that particular doublet rather stands out; in context it becomes jarring, which can mar the "spell" of the whole.

As for "omphalos", I had taken it to mean not only these, but also to include the meaning "a central part; a focal point" (or, at least, to have that associational resonance) as well -- an ironic usage. And, as an aside, while Lovecraft was much more attuned to the Roman rather than Greek, he certainly expressed great admiration for Greece more than once, and even his poetry is loaded with Greek allusions as well a Roman; so that the use of the word in that sense is certainly justified. Once again, my only concern (not even a complaint, really) on this one is much the same as the use of "alike" above -- that it may jar a reader out of the poem itself, shatter (or at least mar) the mood and make it more of a removed, intellectual exercise. (Of course, the same can be said for a great deal of Lovecraft's poetry -- especially from his amateur days of 1914-1926 -- but I thought I'd share that impression with you just FYI, as it were....)

[ghyle]

Originally Posted by j. d. worthington

My thoughts on that one is that it may be a bit too obscure a reference ("every universe in the multiverse" as an ocean, that is). The "all ocean" (singular) might get it across, but I'm not sure of that... Perhaps if "all" were capitalised, it might get it across, though....

How does "the all-ocean" sound to you?

I'm definitely in agreement there... my quibble (and it is a minor one) is that "fire" itself seemed more appropriate to the previous lines, rather than where it is placed, simply because it is more immediately linked associationally to those lines. However, as noted, the structure demands otherwise, so this was just an impression thrown out for what it was worth.

How would swapping the 'fire' and preceding 'dance' refrains look to you?

Actually, I'd argue that "dust" in this case is plural: "fine particles", or "infinitesimal motes"; especially as reinforced by "we", "us", etc. How it struck me was "what dust we [who] defy", or, stated slightly differently: "what dust [are] we [who] defy", hence my suggestion.

I see your point, however dust can work as a collective noun for more than one mote of the stuff, the way rain does, snow, dirt, etc.

Yes, I'd taken all that into account... my only complaint is that use of that particular doublet rather stands out; in context it becomes jarring, which can mar the "spell" of the whole.

How does the following strike you?

Shall my heart in revolt be vain? Let us dust henceforth accept
that such tides we may never fight nor defy, given that star
will thus like us but die, and dance as we dance, due to the weird.

As for "omphalos", I had taken it to mean not only these, but also to include the meaning "a central part; a focal point" (or, at least, to have that associational resonance) as well -- an ironic usage.

I understand your point that it may seem like too much of an intellectual point here. I shall keep it, though, as it would not strike that tone to my ideal reader; besides which, I enjoy the sound and shape of the word immensely.

[HardScienceFan]

Rain check!!!
Sorry Ghyle,after the immensely thoughtful analysis of JD,anything I'd say would look darn silly,I really mean it.

[Ningauble]

Excellent poem, Ghyle, and excellent analysis, j.d.!

[j. d. worthington]

Originally Posted by ghyle

How does "the all-ocean" sound to you?

I think that would work fine.

How would swapping the 'fire' and preceding 'dance' refrains look to you?

I'm trying to avoid vacillating here... but, as I noted earlier, while I think the mental associations (and therefore resonances) might be closer this way, it does mar the structure of the whole; that being the case, I think it probably best to keep it as it was originally.

I see your point, however dust can work as a collective noun for more than one mote of the stuff, the way rain does, snow, dirt, etc.

On this one... it still "feels" awkward to me... but I'd say let it stand nonetheless.

How does the following strike you?

Shall my heart in revolt be vain? Let us dust henceforth accept
that such tides we may never fight nor defy, given that star
will thus like us but die, and dance as we dance, due to the weird.

I've read it over again, once for each... and again I think the original, though feeling a bit awkward, expresses the thought more fully, with more spreading implications, and conveys more of the "cosmic" feel.

I understand your point that it may seem like too much of an intellectual point here. I shall keep it, though, as it would not strike that tone to my ideal reader; besides which, I enjoy the sound and shape of the word immensely.

And on that one... as I said, it was a minor point, and no other word is quite as freighted with not only the manifold meaning, but the classical reference -- and it is a fine word, if rather obscure these days.

At any rate, I quite like the piece and, if it's not one that strikes quite as powerfully on an emotional level immediately, it does grow on one with repeated readings, and becomes quite fascinating.

HSF and Ning -- for myself, thank you... (though it feels very strange getting a compliment for a critique! )

[ghyle]

Originally Posted by j. d. worthington

At any rate, I quite like the piece and, if it's not one that strikes quite as powerfully on an emotional level immediately, it does grow on one with repeated readings, and becomes quite fascinating.

Thank you for the compliment. I hope to work to the best of my ability when I write, and I appreciate the detail and the thought put into your critique. If only every poet were as blest with such an attentive and thoughtful reader!

Ningauble is also an excellent reader, as I know from experience. I always appreciate and consider his feedback, for he is also conscientious, and is also a courteous and considerate fellow.

You would do well, J. D., in SSWFT, given the amount of thought that you put into your replies.

[ghyle]

Here's the second ode:

Roaming in thralldom to beauty, thus seek, seek ever for beauty
true to bestow to us joy, joy that is glorious true,
wrapped in the chiton of glory, of classical heritage writ fair
down on the page of repose, beauty's unbounded repose,
roamer in thralldom to beauty we seek. Imminence of delight's boon,
seek not raptuous ruth, seek alone for us truth,
seek for simplicities fair, for simplicities with hearts furled
into the form of the rose, glorious secular rose
leaved with the hue and the burden of mystically shadow enwrapped fern--
sweet as delight or a troth, fair as a burden of youth
sweet as a mystery dim, in mysterious means of all true art
clad in symbolic design. Clad in both symbol and sign,
wrapped in simplicity's chiton, the runically written is cast first
unto both forces and tropes signalling perilous hope--
hope of the heart and the harp, of all innocence rapt by the bright hearth
reddened by ruminant fire free from enslaving desire,
free yet enslaved due to beauty, delightfully slave to all beauty
clad not in toga of ruth, clad in the toga of truth.

Elegant pleasure's amusement, of beautiful origin set down,
true to bestow to us joy, glorious ruminant joy,
dwell in the present beseech you, so perfectly shape you our vision
seeking to give us no ruth, seeking above all our truth
elegant unto us joy. As embodiment fair of no heart's doubt,
elegant pleasure has voice making us fain to rejoice
crack of the chain and the shackle, the frightening wrack of prison
sought demonstrations of proof everything's rue and is ruth,
dark as the cast of the shadow, that's witlessly split by the prism;
elegant pleasure will stoop?--enter us stepping a troop?
Cast off this prison of wrack: for the elegant pleasure's amusement
stands as archangel afire, ready to health and inspire,
unto us deity given, a marvellous vision uprisen
bright as the eye of all youth, sharp as the light of the tooth,
tongue and the throat of all song, of mysterious lyrics of truth's muse
set in the present to fly unto horizons we spy
never to contemplate past, in a glorious vision of days gone,
days that a classicist's won, days that are dead and are done.

Sweet amusement of fair elegance, come to take
and shape, make me as fire burning, aspiring high
unto skies of a hue beautiful. Make me see
vistas, scenes as of set suns with a terraced view
before gorgeously fair. Come, and awake and shape
my frail flesh to a new knowledge of beauty's signs--
that are set with a hue reddening, copper gleams
of sun brazenly bright. Villages drowsy, dreams
of time eddying slow, softly around the seas
seizing harbours and bells tolling, to tongue and gleam
immemorial thoughts. Parklands alike await,
bowered vistas of rare beauty, of poignant dream
gleaming, glimmerly hung lanterns in twilight scenes
of a poignancy hearts waken and sigh, to speak
with a song of delight--"Grant we all beauty's grace!"
Elegant amusement, I see--you are fair to seek:
you're all, elegance, all, beauty, so wake, believe,
winsome heart: that I dream, seize that I see, oh seize.


AustralianReader.com

It has been published already; hence the market name at the end.