What will they do once the Machines are defeated? - Science Fiction Fantasy Chronicles: forums

Tabitha · 25th February 2003, 04:36 PM

It just occurred to me that there is likely to be a relatively happy ending to the Matrix trilogy - these kind of movies generally end with the good guys winning, but what on earth will they do once they win?

The Earth is a barren wasteland, irradiated and blocked from the sun.
There is likely to be even more destruction by the time the machines are defeated, so what do you think the human survivors will do?

Plug themselves into the Matrix, and live happy and idyllic lives, safe in the knowledge that THEY are controlling the Matrix, not the machines?

Build a great honking big spaceship and rush off to find a more hospitable planet?

Or maybe the easy way out will be taken, and some miraculous regenerative process will have been discovered by the Machines, enabling the victorious humans to return the earth to it's former machine-free state.

Dave · 26th February 2003, 09:32 PM

The free humans do have some kind of undersea city and civilisation -- powered by geothermal energy I would hazard a guess -- we are to discover much more about this in the sequels, so I expect they will continue living there.

EDIT: This thread was begun before anyone had seen Reloaded. Continues now after Animatrix animations and scenes of Zion shown in Relaoded.

timdgreat · 2nd March 2003, 07:38 PM

well i would think they might try to move out from inside the earth, considering the geotheremal power cant last forever, mabye they will find a way to reguvinate the Earth, and clear the sky, i wonder though how they will live with after the machines are gone, like will they ever trust machines again at all?:rolly2:

cersei · 27th May 2003, 10:24 PM

hehe who says the Humans will defeat the Machines? a nice happy hollywood ending is by far from assured...how do they break out of a Matrix that even when they thought they have ie Zion it all turns out to be just another layer of the Matrix?

The solution may lie is cooperation between man and machines as suggested by Counciller Harn and also The Oracle as well...If you watch the Animatrix the machines are not inherently evil and in fact tried to make peace with Humans but were rejected instead..

Maybe the Matrix is just them trying to save us from ourselves? maybe possiblities indeed

but "defeat of machines" is not guranteed by far...

stripes · 28th May 2003, 12:09 AM

Interesting question, the reaction would be worth seeing

Even if the humans triumph over the machines(well as was mentioned, we may get a totally different ending as opposed to "the human victory over machine" ), but, if indeed such a ending happened, it will be difficult to call it a"happy" ending. Neo was shocked after he realized what the "real world" was.

Just fathom what the rest of humanity would think, it would be unbelievable, unimaginable for them to accept the 'real world'. Interesting if this doesn't turn out as your usual, typical hollywood ending.

It would set a precedent no doubt.

I actually hope the ending will be a dark one.

Tabitha · 28th May 2003, 01:17 AM

Since watching Reloaded I am almost expecting a "Nothing is what it seems" resolution. Has anyone seen eXistenZ?

I am still under the impression that even if the real world is indeed real, then Zion isn't exactly an ideal place to live - it is a huge and well-maintained hide-out. Surely the plan wouldn't be to defeat the machines for once and for all, and then just move back down to Zion?

[Stripes: Just fathom what the rest of humanity would think, it would be unbelievable, unimaginable for them to accept the 'real world'. Interesting if this doesn't turn out as your usual, typical hollywood ending.]

When Morpheus says in the first film that the other inhabitants of the Matrix aren't ready to be unplugged, I think this has a huge relevance to the idea of 4 billion humans waking up and finding Earth to be a charred wasteland. I doubt Zion could hold all those people anyway, so it would be a humanitarian catastrophe.

Unless this is all the product of some kid's fevered imagination (It were all a dream, ma

) there CANNOT be an altogether happy hollywood ending to this story. In fact, I think we can compare it to Lord of the Rings from the perspective that, although the Big Bad might have been stopped, the repercussions and aftermath are pretty horrible. Was the effort worth it?

[cersei: Maybe the Matrix is just them trying to save us from ourselves? maybe possiblities indeed ]
Oooh I like this idea!
I am also inclined to think that the final outcome will indeed have an aspect of symbiosis that is palatable to both Machine and Man.
After watching the Second Renaissance Pts 1 & 2, I actually feel sorry for the Machines. They are a lot more sympathetic in my eyes now, and I wouldn't be happy with an ending that shows humanity in complete triumph over the machines - they are just trying to survive, same as the humans are.

Apart from anything else, I can't imagine how a small group of rebels could succeed where the combined might of humanity failed in the war with the machines way back when.

pkgrl · 28th May 2003, 02:48 AM

I like the direction this discussion has taken.

Quote:

Maybe the Matrix is just them trying to save us from ourselves?

Now that would be a neat twist.

I actually don't think that humans will defeat "the machines" either. I think what needs to happen is for the Matrix itself to end. I don't think humans are capable anymore of surviving without the machines. Neo said it himself, "We need machines and machines need us." I don't think that will change even when... whatever needs to happen happens.

cersei · 28th May 2003, 05:40 AM

After what is one of the most powerful ending ever (especially in an "action" film) in a movie, I doubt Matrix Revolutions will be any less

Damn 6 bloody months....

skyron · 28th May 2003, 10:58 PM

Hey, the big question is, what happens to all the millions of "pod people" in the battery farms? if the humans win the infrastructure that keeps the vast majority of humanity alive will, presumably, break down. can the Zionotes free all those people before they die and rot? Ewwwww.

pkgrl · 29th May 2003, 12:55 AM

Actually, I was thinking about this even more and I think that what will happen is that control of the Matrix will change hands first. (Or should.)

I think that's what Smith and Neo are ultimately battling for: control of the Matrix (and everything else).

Right now, humans are slaves and the Zionites want to free them. I don't know if actual physical freedom is possible... not for a while... but if humans control the Matrix, they can begin to change things, educate people, free them a few at a time... something!

But I don't think destroying the machines or even the Matrix is a viable option immediately. Too many people would die... and rot? :disturbed

Tabitha · 29th May 2003, 01:04 AM

After another watching of the sequel I would agree that control is a big factor. The function of the Oracle is a control, allowing Zion to exist at all is a control, etc etc.

And yep, I think you are right - 'ownership' of the Matrix changing hands is a likely avenue. Think of all the fun you could have in that world if you weren't fighting against something? And as I said above, the sheer logistics of all those people being unplugged are untenable.

However, I wonder if the humans would be able to control the Matrix? Perhaps we would need an AI in order to actually run it?

Dave · 29th May 2003, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tabitha
However, I wonder if the humans would be able to control the Matrix? Perhaps we would need an AI in order to actually run it?

Which is probably the reason for that little speech from Councillor Hamann to Neo when they walked down to the lower level of Zion.

timdgreat · 30th May 2003, 09:30 PM

Another question, if the theory that the real world is another part of the matrix then what do u think the real REAl world looks like? do u think that its totally decimated like the one we see?:rolly2:

stripes · 30th May 2003, 11:44 PM

I think it will resemble Zion on a global scale. Perhaps we will be able to see the scorched sky Morpheous shows us in the original?

I have a feeling the camera will fade out to the humans shagging it out, much like the dance off in Reloaded, except bigger. More raving, more shagadelic dancing, groovy hippie stuff.

It will be interesting if it was anyway.

Dave · 30th May 2003, 11:56 PM

Timdgreat has a point, if Zion is also a virtual reality, what IS the real world like. The surface may not be devastated at all, man may never have destroyed the sky, the machines could have lied and written a false history. The Second Renaissance could be a work of fiction!

It could be all green fields with sheep and bunny rabbits!

25th February 2003, 04:36 PM	#1 (permalink)
Tabitha Save Angel! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 3,638	What will they do once the Machines are defeated? It just occurred to me that there is likely to be a relatively happy ending to the Matrix trilogy - these kind of movies generally end with the good guys winning, but what on earth will they do once they win? The Earth is a barren wasteland, irradiated and blocked from the sun. There is likely to be even more destruction by the time the machines are defeated, so what do you think the human survivors will do? Plug themselves into the Matrix, and live happy and idyllic lives, safe in the knowledge that THEY are controlling the Matrix, not the machines? Build a great honking big spaceship and rush off to find a more hospitable planet? Or maybe the easy way out will be taken, and some miraculous regenerative process will have been discovered by the Machines, enabling the victorious humans to return the earth to it's former machine-free state.

27th May 2003, 10:24 PM	#4 (permalink)
cersei Matriculated Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 126	Defeat the Machines??? hehe who says the Humans will defeat the Machines? a nice happy hollywood ending is by far from assured...how do they break out of a Matrix that even when they thought they have ie Zion it all turns out to be just another layer of the Matrix? The solution may lie is cooperation between man and machines as suggested by Counciller Harn and also The Oracle as well...If you watch the Animatrix the machines are not inherently evil and in fact tried to make peace with Humans but were rejected instead.. Maybe the Matrix is just them trying to save us from ourselves? maybe possiblities indeed but "defeat of machines" is not guranteed by far...

28th May 2003, 05:40 AM	#8 (permalink)
cersei Matriculated Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 126	W Brothers won't let us down... After what is one of the most powerful ending ever (especially in an "action" film) in a movie, I doubt Matrix Revolutions will be any less Damn 6 bloody months....

29th May 2003, 12:55 AM	#10 (permalink)
pkgrl Ultimate J/A shipper! Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Southern California Posts: 2,423	Rot? EWWWWWW! Actually, I was thinking about this even more and I think that what will happen is that control of the Matrix will change hands first. (Or should.) I think that's what Smith and Neo are ultimately battling for: control of the Matrix (and everything else). Right now, humans are slaves and the Zionites want to free them. I don't know if actual physical freedom is possible... not for a while... but if humans control the Matrix, they can begin to change things, educate people, free them a few at a time... something! But I don't think destroying the machines or even the Matrix is a viable option immediately. Too many people would die... and rot? :disturbed

26th February 2003, 09:32 PM	#2 (permalink)
Dave Wherever I Am, I'm There Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Greater London Posts: 11,424	The free humans do have some kind of undersea city and civilisation -- powered by geothermal energy I would hazard a guess -- we are to discover much more about this in the sequels, so I expect they will continue living there. EDIT: This thread was begun before anyone had seen Reloaded. Continues now after Animatrix animations and scenes of Zion shown in Relaoded.

2nd March 2003, 07:38 PM	#3 (permalink)
timdgreat For the Emperor Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Alexandria VA, USA(Washington DC u idiots) Posts: 3,093	well i would think they might try to move out from inside the earth, considering the geotheremal power cant last forever, mabye they will find a way to reguvinate the Earth, and clear the sky, i wonder though how they will live with after the machines are gone, like will they ever trust machines again at all?:rolly2:

28th May 2003, 12:09 AM	#5 (permalink)
stripes Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: toronto,ontario Posts: 46	Interesting question, the reaction would be worth seeing Even if the humans triumph over the machines(well as was mentioned, we may get a totally different ending as opposed to "the human victory over machine" ), but, if indeed such a ending happened, it will be difficult to call it a"happy" ending. Neo was shocked after he realized what the "real world" was. Just fathom what the rest of humanity would think, it would be unbelievable, unimaginable for them to accept the 'real world'. Interesting if this doesn't turn out as your usual, typical hollywood ending. It would set a precedent no doubt. I actually hope the ending will be a dark one.

28th May 2003, 01:17 AM	#6 (permalink)
Tabitha Save Angel! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 3,638	Since watching Reloaded I am almost expecting a "Nothing is what it seems" resolution. Has anyone seen eXistenZ? I am still under the impression that even if the real world is indeed real, then Zion isn't exactly an ideal place to live - it is a huge and well-maintained hide-out. Surely the plan wouldn't be to defeat the machines for once and for all, and then just move back down to Zion? [Stripes: Just fathom what the rest of humanity would think, it would be unbelievable, unimaginable for them to accept the 'real world'. Interesting if this doesn't turn out as your usual, typical hollywood ending.] When Morpheus says in the first film that the other inhabitants of the Matrix aren't ready to be unplugged, I think this has a huge relevance to the idea of 4 billion humans waking up and finding Earth to be a charred wasteland. I doubt Zion could hold all those people anyway, so it would be a humanitarian catastrophe. Unless this is all the product of some kid's fevered imagination (It were all a dream, ma ) there CANNOT be an altogether happy hollywood ending to this story. In fact, I think we can compare it to Lord of the Rings from the perspective that, although the Big Bad might have been stopped, the repercussions and aftermath are pretty horrible. Was the effort worth it? [cersei: Maybe the Matrix is just them trying to save us from ourselves? maybe possiblities indeed ] Oooh I like this idea! I am also inclined to think that the final outcome will indeed have an aspect of symbiosis that is palatable to both Machine and Man. After watching the Second Renaissance Pts 1 & 2, I actually feel sorry for the Machines. They are a lot more sympathetic in my eyes now, and I wouldn't be happy with an ending that shows humanity in complete triumph over the machines - they are just trying to survive, same as the humans are. Apart from anything else, I can't imagine how a small group of rebels could succeed where the combined might of humanity failed in the war with the machines way back when.

28th May 2003, 10:58 PM	#9 (permalink)
skyron Member Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 33	Hey, the big question is, what happens to all the millions of "pod people" in the battery farms? if the humans win the infrastructure that keeps the vast majority of humanity alive will, presumably, break down. can the Zionotes free all those people before they die and rot? Ewwwww.

29th May 2003, 01:04 AM	#11 (permalink)
Tabitha Save Angel! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 3,638	After another watching of the sequel I would agree that control is a big factor. The function of the Oracle is a control, allowing Zion to exist at all is a control, etc etc. And yep, I think you are right - 'ownership' of the Matrix changing hands is a likely avenue. Think of all the fun you could have in that world if you weren't fighting against something? And as I said above, the sheer logistics of all those people being unplugged are untenable. However, I wonder if the humans would be able to control the Matrix? Perhaps we would need an AI in order to actually run it?

30th May 2003, 09:30 PM	#13 (permalink)
timdgreat For the Emperor Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Alexandria VA, USA(Washington DC u idiots) Posts: 3,093	Another question, if the theory that the real world is another part of the matrix then what do u think the real REAl world looks like? do u think that its totally decimated like the one we see?:rolly2:

30th May 2003, 11:44 PM	#14 (permalink)
stripes Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: toronto,ontario Posts: 46	I think it will resemble Zion on a global scale. Perhaps we will be able to see the scorched sky Morpheous shows us in the original? I have a feeling the camera will fade out to the humans shagging it out, much like the dance off in Reloaded, except bigger. More raving, more shagadelic dancing, groovy hippie stuff. It will be interesting if it was anyway.

30th May 2003, 11:56 PM	#15 (permalink)
Dave Wherever I Am, I'm There Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Greater London Posts: 11,424	Timdgreat has a point, if Zion is also a virtual reality, what IS the real world like. The surface may not be devastated at all, man may never have destroyed the sky, the machines could have lied and written a false history. The Second Renaissance could be a work of fiction! It could be all green fields with sheep and bunny rabbits!