6.08: The Other Guys - Page 3 - Science Fiction Fantasy Chronicles: forums

webmouse · 7th August 2002, 06:25 PM

Well, instead of killing off characters, perhaps the writers should hedge their bets if S7 is even being contemplated. Retirements? Quests? Long-term assignments to off-world missions?

I've begun to realize how few series have an actual story arc that runs through the season, much less through the run of the entire series. I asked a friend who wrote for STNG if the writers had figured out the second part of "Best of Both Worlds" when the cliff-hanger of part one had been shot. The startling answer was "no, not a clue."

The previous ep "Shadow Play" was put in an odd place in the series, considering that JQ is offered a full pardon from his home planet. But we know he can't accept, because (if for no other reason) he still has the remaining eps of S6 to complete. "Shadow Play" would have fit better later, when we might actually believe JQ could consider a return to Calonna (if any of it remains, of course). "Other Guys" has the advantage of being a nice light ep with no drastic plot changes. Could fit in anywhere -- as long as Khonsu doesn't have to show up again.

Falcon Horus · 7th August 2002, 09:55 PM

I considered this episode the funniest one they ever made. Really the point of view thing was really cool and the scientist were just geeky enough!

I had a really good time watching it!!

Falcon Horus

lisasg1 · 8th August 2002, 02:32 AM

I thought that they'd have set out what happens in the second part of a cliff - hanger.:alienooh:

OH well, but it was a very funny episode, the one-liners rocked!

webmouse · 10th August 2002, 07:16 PM

There was something missing from this ep, one of those things that comes up after having some time to think about it. There was no logic to the purported plan of meeting with Khonsu.

The team allows themselves to be captured in order to get info that could only come directly from Khonsu who had to remain deep under-cover in the ranks of Anubis. So, assuming all went as planned (which of course it didn't), they would be brought before Khonsu, who would send all his minions away, have a good old natter with the team and then -- what?

He lets them go? They "overpower" him and escape? Either way he is complicit or incompetent, not likely to last long in the service of Anubis. Or perhaps SG1 kidnaps Khonsu -- oh, but then he can't continue his valuable service to Anubis. OK, maybe they kidnap him, escape back to Earth, then he "escapes" from them and returns to Anubis. Somehow I think Anubis wouldn't fall for that one either.

So, the plot only works if we accept from the beginning that SG1 and Khonsu's meeting plan was flawed from the start, doomed to failure and possible death for all parties involved. And General Hammond approved this? The Tok'ra High Council thought this was ok? Incompetence all around, but mostly in the writing team, if you want my opinion (and even if you didn't

)

ZachWZ · 11th August 2002, 07:04 AM

About ten minutes into this ep. i realized it was a dream for something VR. Everything kept on going the geeks way. no guards in the enterance room. Just happening to find the team in the air duct. not being scene in the murder of the double agent. The super hacking in the Gould computer. Reading these comments about the ep am I the only one who realized this?

This ep was basically 2 a spoof of Sci Fi action in generial.

ZachWZ

webmouse · 11th August 2002, 06:16 PM

Certainly I have considered that the story was all in Felger's imagination, but the writers did not want that to be explicit, even at the end, so only the kiss is clearly fantasy.

But with the tremendous plot hole about SG1's plan to meet Khonsu, I'd have to say that the only explanation is that the whole thing was a daydream -- no need to cover plot holes in ones fantasy.

To make the story "real" then the plan should have been to extract Khonsu, rather than just to meet. Either way, once SG1 is taken and then departs, Khonsu is out of a job with Anubis.

Cute, but implausible episode. Lots of fun as long as you don't think too much about it. Chant the mantra "Entertainment Value."

shu_hunter · 15th October 2002, 10:08 PM

I still think the best quote was "At least my heroes exist." - Felger (Patrick McKenna from the Red Green Show)
I laughed so hard when I saw a pic for this episode and there was Harold on Stargate SG-1.

~Shu Hunter
:upto: Stargate fan{atic}

webmouse · 16th October 2002, 01:27 PM

Only fair for "SG1" to go after "Star Trek" -- after all they made fun of themselves in "Wormhole X-treme"

Dave · 7th November 2002, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by webmouse
Certainly I have considered that the story was all in Felger's imagination, but the writers did not want that to be explicit, even at the end, so only the kiss is clearly fantasy.

Quote:

Originally posted by CynVision
I can forgive them for going Dallas on us.

So, two episodes in a row have simply be mind-games; purely in the imagination of some secondary character. I can't excuse them doing a "Dallas" on us. Next week, Daniel comes out of the shower and the whole of S6 has been a dream; he didn't die at all, it's all a dream.

Quote:

Originally posted by webmouse
Only fair for "SG1" to go after "Star Trek" -- after all they made fun of themselves in "Wormhole X-treme"

They have been making small Star Trek references all of S6. It's not funny anymore. Dr. Phlox and the Geeks made too many references IMHO. I don't think scientists subscribe to the "Everything I know I owe to Star Trek" idea really.

Quote:

Originally posted by skydiver
this eps was full of great quotes.

Has SG-1 really saved the Earth 8 times as Teal'c corrects?

I liked the Jack-ism inside the force-shield:

Jack (to Teal'c): Don't touch that! (after touching it himself.)

Quote:

Originally posted by webmouse
They still need to give JQ more to do.

Sam (to JQ): Your not smiling... ...but it's the first time you've been captured by a Gou'ald.

pamie · 7th November 2002, 10:02 PM

Not much to add to what had already been said apart from I thought it was a really funny one...got kinda bored with it towards the end but some great one liners from Jack and co.

Wingless Flyer · 9th November 2002, 07:51 PM

I loved it

Tabitha · 9th November 2002, 09:08 PM

I laughed so long and so hard at this episode. I have to say I don't think the trek references were too overdone. In fact I didn't even connect the name "John Billingsley" in the credits with Dr Phlox until afterwards, duhhhhh. The "I don't know how you can call yourself a scientist and not worship at the font of Roddenberry" bit is even funnier since I realised that. And btw Dave - I think his assertion that all scientists must be huge trek fans was only really applicable to himself - as the other two weren't fans, apparently.
The redshirts bit really made me laff - if you were ever in that kinda position, isn't that what you would say

Sam's crack to Jonas about this experience being new really fell flat for me. I just thought *groan* surely there would be something more appropriate to say in a situation like that. Although, at that point we didn't know that they had been caught on purpose, so maybe it is more apt than I thought.

It never really occurred to me until I read this thread that the ENTIRE story might be a dream - I assumed that it was just the medals and kiss

But, you guys brought up a good point there - it did seem a bit too easy for the geeks to wander through that ship.

One thing that did tick me off, as some of you have already touched upon in this thread is that another (gorgeous) Tok'ra bites the dust.

I reckon that we should get some of our favourite characters back by some kind of messing about with the Quantum mirror from TBFTGOG. After all, the writers did want to bring JR Bourne back for another ep in S6. Maybe we could really have him (and Kawalsky anyone) back for the final season.

Wingless Flyer · 9th November 2002, 11:46 PM

Quote:

The redshirts bit really made me laff

I can't believe I got that one, very funny (if not a bit sad

)

Tabitha · 10th November 2002, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Wingless Flyer

I can't believe I got that one, very funny (if not a bit sad )

Oh it's not that sad really.

Err, I hope...

Brit Chick · 10th November 2002, 09:53 PM

they do this don't they - the SG writers, they like to do a show which is really just for for fun at least once in a season, and I love it.

I don't think every ep has to be deep and meaningful, we get shed loads of those so its cool to just sit back and enjoy the ride. You kind of get the impression they write ones like this for themselves and the fans, just so we can all enjoy the 'in' jokes - they have to know a big percentage of the SG fans are also into Star Trek and being a big trek fan myself I also loved the trek references - the red shirt thing was a classic. Plus, Coombs getting v.stroppy with Felger 'I don't know how you can call yourself a scientist and not worship at the altar of Roddenberry' (or words to that effect) :rolly2:

10th August 2002, 07:16 PM	#34 (permalink)
webmouse Fearless Mouse Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Silver Spring, Maryland Posts: 1,159	What was missing There was something missing from this ep, one of those things that comes up after having some time to think about it. There was no logic to the purported plan of meeting with Khonsu. The team allows themselves to be captured in order to get info that could only come directly from Khonsu who had to remain deep under-cover in the ranks of Anubis. So, assuming all went as planned (which of course it didn't), they would be brought before Khonsu, who would send all his minions away, have a good old natter with the team and then -- what? He lets them go? They "overpower" him and escape? Either way he is complicit or incompetent, not likely to last long in the service of Anubis. Or perhaps SG1 kidnaps Khonsu -- oh, but then he can't continue his valuable service to Anubis. OK, maybe they kidnap him, escape back to Earth, then he "escapes" from them and returns to Anubis. Somehow I think Anubis wouldn't fall for that one either. So, the plot only works if we accept from the beginning that SG1 and Khonsu's meeting plan was flawed from the start, doomed to failure and possible death for all parties involved. And General Hammond approved this? The Tok'ra High Council thought this was ok? Incompetence all around, but mostly in the writing team, if you want my opinion (and even if you didn't )

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7th August 2002, 06:25 PM	#31 (permalink)
webmouse Fearless Mouse Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Silver Spring, Maryland Posts: 1,159	Well, instead of killing off characters, perhaps the writers should hedge their bets if S7 is even being contemplated. Retirements? Quests? Long-term assignments to off-world missions? I've begun to realize how few series have an actual story arc that runs through the season, much less through the run of the entire series. I asked a friend who wrote for STNG if the writers had figured out the second part of "Best of Both Worlds" when the cliff-hanger of part one had been shot. The startling answer was "no, not a clue." The previous ep "Shadow Play" was put in an odd place in the series, considering that JQ is offered a full pardon from his home planet. But we know he can't accept, because (if for no other reason) he still has the remaining eps of S6 to complete. "Shadow Play" would have fit better later, when we might actually believe JQ could consider a return to Calonna (if any of it remains, of course). "Other Guys" has the advantage of being a nice light ep with no drastic plot changes. Could fit in anywhere -- as long as Khonsu doesn't have to show up again.

7th August 2002, 09:55 PM	#32 (permalink)
Falcon Horus Keeper of the Gate Join Date: May 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 668	I considered this episode the funniest one they ever made. Really the point of view thing was really cool and the scientist were just geeky enough! I had a really good time watching it!! Falcon Horus

8th August 2002, 02:32 AM	#33 (permalink)
lisasg1 Huge fan Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Ireland Posts: 1,183	I thought that they'd have set out what happens in the second part of a cliff - hanger.:alienooh: OH well, but it was a very funny episode, the one-liners rocked!

11th August 2002, 07:04 AM	#35 (permalink)
ZachWZ Pre 1986 Comics Fan Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Ottawa county MI USA Posts: 592	About ten minutes into this ep. i realized it was a dream for something VR. Everything kept on going the geeks way. no guards in the enterance room. Just happening to find the team in the air duct. not being scene in the murder of the double agent. The super hacking in the Gould computer. Reading these comments about the ep am I the only one who realized this? This ep was basically 2 a spoof of Sci Fi action in generial. ZachWZ

11th August 2002, 06:16 PM	#36 (permalink)
webmouse Fearless Mouse Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Silver Spring, Maryland Posts: 1,159	Certainly I have considered that the story was all in Felger's imagination, but the writers did not want that to be explicit, even at the end, so only the kiss is clearly fantasy. But with the tremendous plot hole about SG1's plan to meet Khonsu, I'd have to say that the only explanation is that the whole thing was a daydream -- no need to cover plot holes in ones fantasy. To make the story "real" then the plan should have been to extract Khonsu, rather than just to meet. Either way, once SG1 is taken and then departs, Khonsu is out of a job with Anubis. Cute, but implausible episode. Lots of fun as long as you don't think too much about it. Chant the mantra "Entertainment Value."

15th October 2002, 10:08 PM	#37 (permalink)
shu_hunter Stargate fan[atic] Join Date: May 2001 Location: Quebec, Canada Posts: 165	I still think the best quote was "At least my heroes exist." - Felger (Patrick McKenna from the Red Green Show) I laughed so hard when I saw a pic for this episode and there was Harold on Stargate SG-1. ~Shu Hunter :upto: Stargate fan{atic}

16th October 2002, 01:27 PM	#38 (permalink)
webmouse Fearless Mouse Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Silver Spring, Maryland Posts: 1,159	Only fair for "SG1" to go after "Star Trek" -- after all they made fun of themselves in "Wormhole X-treme"

7th November 2002, 10:02 PM	#40 (permalink)
pamie Space Monkey! Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: South coast of the UK Posts: 3,091	Not much to add to what had already been said apart from I thought it was a really funny one...got kinda bored with it towards the end but some great one liners from Jack and co.

9th November 2002, 07:51 PM	#41 (permalink)
Wingless Flyer Expert Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 337	I loved it

9th November 2002, 09:08 PM	#42 (permalink)
Tabitha Save Angel! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 3,638	I laughed so long and so hard at this episode. I have to say I don't think the trek references were too overdone. In fact I didn't even connect the name "John Billingsley" in the credits with Dr Phlox until afterwards, duhhhhh. The "I don't know how you can call yourself a scientist and not worship at the font of Roddenberry" bit is even funnier since I realised that. And btw Dave - I think his assertion that all scientists must be huge trek fans was only really applicable to himself - as the other two weren't fans, apparently. The redshirts bit really made me laff - if you were ever in that kinda position, isn't that what you would say Sam's crack to Jonas about this experience being new really fell flat for me. I just thought groan surely there would be something more appropriate to say in a situation like that. Although, at that point we didn't know that they had been caught on purpose, so maybe it is more apt than I thought. It never really occurred to me until I read this thread that the ENTIRE story might be a dream - I assumed that it was just the medals and kiss But, you guys brought up a good point there - it did seem a bit too easy for the geeks to wander through that ship. One thing that did tick me off, as some of you have already touched upon in this thread is that another (gorgeous) Tok'ra bites the dust. I reckon that we should get some of our favourite characters back by some kind of messing about with the Quantum mirror from TBFTGOG. After all, the writers did want to bring JR Bourne back for another ep in S6. Maybe we could really have him (and Kawalsky anyone) back for the final season.

10th November 2002, 09:53 PM	#45 (permalink)
Brit Chick Ooh look - shiny things ! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: London Posts: 277	they do this don't they - the SG writers, they like to do a show which is really just for for fun at least once in a season, and I love it. I don't think every ep has to be deep and meaningful, we get shed loads of those so its cool to just sit back and enjoy the ride. You kind of get the impression they write ones like this for themselves and the fans, just so we can all enjoy the 'in' jokes - they have to know a big percentage of the SG fans are also into Star Trek and being a big trek fan myself I also loved the trek references - the red shirt thing was a classic. Plus, Coombs getting v.stroppy with Felger 'I don't know how you can call yourself a scientist and not worship at the altar of Roddenberry' (or words to that effect) :rolly2: