Star Trek story cliches, old chestnuts, and plundered ideas.

[Dave]

I've just read two other threads which made me think of starting this one:

Roach compared 'Angel One' to 'Spocks Brain' (he actually confused them.)

Highlander II on 'Enterprise' 'Strange New world'. (Small spoiler)
quote:
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Originally posted by Highlander II
now they've done the 'crew goes nuts/psycho' ep - it's time for 'the crew grows old', 'the crew loses all it's inhibitions', and 'the crew loses it's memory' -- not to mention, that one of the crew members should be impregnated by an alien being, and then one or more must be kidnapped, and they have to encounter some big bad computer that runs the planet - and there HAS to be the 'crew gets sent back/forward in time' ep - can't forget that one --
oh - a crew member must die and be brought back to life -- that always happens ---
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she missed out the:

They meet someones Evil Twin ('Lore' TNG, 'Turnabout Intruder' TOS, 'Displaced' VOY, 'The Assignment' DS9. and any Founders episode.)

They go to a planet were women are in charge ('Angel One' TNG, 'Spocks Brain' TOS)

And the most unlikely lowly Cadet or Ensign, child (or dog) saves the ship (any Wesley or Harry Kim episode).

In TOS how many times does Kirk encounter a screwed-up culture and does something altering the circumstances to fix it.

But in TNG how many stories have been where some mysterious alien tortures one of the crew, or they get amnesia, or encounter a powerful alien that threatens the ship, but escape, never to communicate with the lifeform?

Many early Season 'Next Generation' episodes were criticised for being too similar to episodes of 'the original series':

'Encounter at Farpoint' TNG ~ 'The Changeling' TOS and 'Squire of Gothos' TOS.
'The Naked Now' TNG ~ 'The Naked Time' TOS.
'Where No One Has Gone Before' TNG ~ 'Where No Man Has Gone Before' TOS but plundered from the novel 'The Wounded Sky' by Diane Duane.
'Unnatural Selection' TNG ~ 'The Deadly Years' TOS with an ending from 'Counter-clock Incident' (animated) and a solution that suggests that a character could be resurrected in the Transporter.
'Lonely Among us' TNG ~ 'Journey to Babel' TOS.
'Home Soil' TNG ~ 'Devil in the Dark' TOS.
'The Neutral Zone' TNG ~ 'Space Seed' TOS.

Then there is VOY 'Workforce' which is very similar to Stargate SG-1 'Beneath the Surface'.

And not forgetting the 'Character or crew member replaced by a doppleganger from an alternative timeline/universe': DS9 'Resurection' and any other mirror universe story in DS9 or TOS, but also DS9 'Visionary' ~ VOY 'Deadlock'

It is surprising that they will still pay an author to dig up some same old story, rather than write something new, but as i wrote somewhere else there are meant to be only 5 original stories at all and every story is just a variation of those. I can't remember what the five stories are now.

[Highlander II]

okay - 1st -- H2 (me) is female -- not offended - just clearing up stuff --


2nd -- there are only 5 storylines? i heard it was like 30 -- hmmm - perhaps we should find out what they are??

and my only comment on the 'TNG was too much like TOS' - the eps "The Naked Time" and "The Naked Now" - wasn't "The Naked Now" supposed to be like "The Naked Time"? they did it on purpose -- and it makes sense - i mean, are we to assume that there is NO way that the next group of ppl on the Enterprise wouldn't encounter some of the same things as the 1st group? and they even changed it so it was a mutated form of the 'virus' and Dr. Crusher had to come up w/ a 'new and improved' solution to use --

there was even a similar ep in DS9 - "Fascination" - when Mrs. Troi had Xanthe (sp?) Fever - it had 'similar' effects -- fun ep too!




spoiler for Enterprise ------->








3rd - the 'crew member impregnated by an alien being' has been done now on Ent --

[Dave]

OK, Sorry H2, consider it edited, talk to Skip about it sometime!

I'll try and find out about the x number of story ideas, and we can match them to scifi films and episodes.

I know that some of the TNG shows were meant to be a homage to TOS, but that's a lame excuse for unoriginality.

[Highlander II]

not a problem --

and 'paying homage' is okay -- it's not the 1st time a 'follow up' series has borrowed a story idea from it's predecessor -- and it actually makes for a nice tie-in if it's done right ---

but, no, it's no excuse for lack of originality -

[Neo]

AM i missing something

[Dave]

Originally posted by Neo
AM i missing something

There was an article in the news recently (but it is a story that appears frequently) that there are no new stories in the world. There are only 5 basic plots, with about thirty-odd subplots. Some of these are familiar Shakespearean themes -- Boy meets girl, falls in love, love cannot be -- or, twins separated at birth, meet up again and get confused for each other.

I cannot find the article, but I just thought that it would have been interesting to match these plots to Star Trek stories.

For example, the twins would be Data & "Lore" TNG.

[Neo]

IC.. thanxs Dave.....

[Highlander II]

okay - found this website that goes into an explanation of how many 'basic' plots there are - ranging from 1 to 36/37 --

The "Basic" Plots in Literature


it's pretty interesting -- and kinda long, but has some explanations and references ---

[Neo]

Thanxs H2

[Highlander II]

you bet -

just a quick google.com search - and that's what i got -

got some other weird hits too --

does this mean we'll see some writing from Neo???

[Dave]

Thanks, that's exactly what I was looking for, couldn't find it anywhere.

Here are the 37 plots then:

1.Supplication (in which the Supplicant must beg something from Power in authority)
2.Deliverance
3.Crime Pursued by Vengeance
4.Vengeance taken for kindred upon kindred
5.Pursuit
6.Disaster
7.Falling Prey to Cruelty of Misfortune
8.Revolt
9.Daring Enterprise
10.Abduction
11.The Enigma (temptation or a riddle)
12.Obtaining
13.Enmity of Kinsmen
14.Rivalry of Kinsmen
15.Murderous Adultery
16.Madness
17.Fatal Imprudence
18.Involuntary Crimes of Love (example: discovery that one has married one's mother, sister, etc.)
19.Slaying of a Kinsman Unrecognized
20.Self-Sacrificing for an Ideal
21.Self-Sacrifice for Kindred
22.All Sacrificed for Passion
23.Necessity of Sacrificing Loved Ones
24.Rivalry of Superior and Inferior
25.Adultery
26.Crimes of Love
27.Discovery of the Dishonor of a Loved One
28.Obstacles to Love
29.An Enemy Loved
30.Ambition
31.Conflict with a God
32.Mistaken Jealousy
33.Erroneous Judgement
34.Remorse
35.Recovery of a Lost One
36.Loss of Loved Ones.
37.Mistaken Identity

[Highlander II]

yep -- basically - i guess those are the 37 'subplots' -b/c you can group those into larger plots and get the 5 (i think it was) that were listed just above that -- or into the 7 that were also listed -

just depends on how you look at them ---