3.13: The Devil You Know - Science Fiction Fantasy Chronicles: forums

MythingLink · 15th September 2001, 07:01 PM

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PTeppic · 16th September 2001, 05:36 AM

After the stuff with the iris in Serpents Song, I was expecting Sokar to be more powerful, personally. Souped up ribbon device type stuff.

kelsi · 8th October 2001, 06:55 PM

But generally, did you like it? Makes me laugh looking at Apophis creeping back up into power. He's such a great orator (sp?)!

shiloh · 9th October 2001, 08:40 PM

Liked it alot. Any show where pretty much everyone gets whumped is fine by me! And a total angst-fest to top it off!!

But seriously, yeah, very cool, though I agree Sokhar wasn't intimidating enough for my taste. But Apophis-mon more than makes up for that. Those scenes with Jolinar and Bynarr were too creepy for words. Added an entire new level of horror.

Daniel: Your mate, Amaunet, is dead. Sorry to ruin your day. No, actually, I'm wrong about that. I'm not sorry.

Jack: Ice tea.... air conditioning ... water.

kelsi · 19th May 2002, 12:06 AM

Thread resurection...

I think there was good character development, good potential, and hints, they should do dramatic eps like this mroe often!

PTeppic · 19th May 2002, 09:23 AM

Just thinking about it now, what makes a really BAD bad-guy? Someone who really intimidates, who has presence, and threat? Know what I mean? For all his pale-faced malevolence, there really wasn't much evil in the character shown for Sokar. Now I know that most of his power comes from the Jaffa, and against his own people from the technology. But to the wised-up humans, he was just another man on the throne who was nothing special.

Imagine someone like "Hannibal the Cannibal" getting that level of technological advantage. But, having watched the two with Tony Hopkins, it was perhaps the confinement and promise of escape which gave the most powerful performance. So, what does this mean for SG-1. Perhaps a psychotic (more so!) Goa'uld who is currently imprisoned by the Goa'uld themselves (or Tok'ra). Someone who mightr have important info?

Nope - probably just rambling again...

kelsi · 19th May 2002, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by PTeppic
Just thinking about it now, what makes a really BAD bad-guy?

Depends what you mean by that. Someone you love to hate, or someone you actually hate? I love to hate ... Apophis, or Tanith, but nobody that I actually hate. If you get that.

PTeppic · 26th May 2002, 08:50 AM

I suppose it can be difficult to build up sufficient tension and history into a character just in the pre-titles, so that they have the background to support the personality by the time we see them?

jwells · 24th July 2002, 01:45 PM

I am so glad Apophis has been brought back. His Phantom of the Opera look adds to his overall creepiness. After having various episodes of cameo appearances, he finally gets an episode where he's in it all the way through. I especially liked the bit where he tells Kintac his plans for Sokar, that springblade was wicked! I still love that Goa'uld Pain Stick used to torture Apophis. It was a good ending where Apophis suddenly leaps up, stabs one of the Red Guards, deflects the other one's staff, swings round and cuts his throat, tries to shoot Sokar and then runs for it all in one go! Now that is action! It was also great having the final shot of the show showing Apophis alive on Delmak.

ReplicatorX · 24th September 2003, 07:01 AM

This episode is probably my favourite episode from Season 3 and I would have to disagree about Sokar, I found him to be very sinister and intimidating, he seems like one of them silent evil kinds, where no one really knows what his thinking. I found him to be slightly more evil then Anubis.

jwells · 24th September 2003, 09:57 AM

Interesting comment, considering they're both the same actor!

ReplicatorX · 24th September 2003, 12:14 PM

Yeah I mentioned Anubis because of that reason and also they both are quite similar characters. Both wear hoods, Anubis is a bit more mysterious than Sokar, I loved how they gave Sokar such pale skin, looked great.

PTeppic · 24th September 2003, 06:40 PM

To be honest I found him difficult to take him seriously. He had considerably too little screen time to give over any sort of lounging menace, i.e. sitting back and condemning to death great hordes of supplicants. He also never seemed to show emotion, hate, leading to anger, etc.

There was just a bloke in a big hood with lots of troops. So what.

Dave · 17th December 2005, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by PTeppic
Just thinking about it now, what makes a really BAD bad-guy?

Quote:

Originally posted by PTeppic
He also never seemed to show emotion, hate, leading to anger, etc. There was just a bloke in a big hood with lots of troops. So what.

I think the best bad guys do have character development and reasons for doing what they are doing.

In real life, even the most evil people don't wake up in the morning and say "today I am going to be really evil", they have reasons for doing what they do, which they believe to be either correct or else have no other choice. They may be wrong from everyone else's point of view but not from their own. Bullies have usually been the victims of bullies, wife beaters were beaten by their father's themselves, terrorists have a political or religious cause, unpopular dictators know that their enemies would kill them first given any chance, even Harold Shipman (UK's largest mass murderer) thought he was doing the old ladies a favour.

Spoiler for Season 9
Doesn't Sokar look a little too Ori -like looking back now?

15th September 2001, 07:01 PM	#1 (permalink)
MythingLink First Prime of ASciFi Join Date: Jul 2000 Posts: 1,798	3.13 : The Devil You Know ----------------------------- Creating topic, remember you can only discuss this episode inside this topic. Reviews of the episode are encouraged -----------------------------

24th July 2002, 01:45 PM	#9 (permalink)
jwells Advanced Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Brighton, England Posts: 121	Apophis Returns I am so glad Apophis has been brought back. His Phantom of the Opera look adds to his overall creepiness. After having various episodes of cameo appearances, he finally gets an episode where he's in it all the way through. I especially liked the bit where he tells Kintac his plans for Sokar, that springblade was wicked! I still love that Goa'uld Pain Stick used to torture Apophis. It was a good ending where Apophis suddenly leaps up, stabs one of the Red Guards, deflects the other one's staff, swings round and cuts his throat, tries to shoot Sokar and then runs for it all in one go! Now that is action! It was also great having the final shot of the show showing Apophis alive on Delmak.

16th September 2001, 05:36 AM	#2 (permalink)
PTeppic Reetou Diplomatic Corp Join Date: May 2001 Location: North-west UK Posts: 3,086	After the stuff with the iris in Serpents Song, I was expecting Sokar to be more powerful, personally. Souped up ribbon device type stuff.

8th October 2001, 06:55 PM	#3 (permalink)
kelsi Expert Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Sitting in front of my computer, at home, on Chulak. Posts: 1,411	But generally, did you like it? Makes me laugh looking at Apophis creeping back up into power. He's such a great orator (sp?)!

9th October 2001, 08:40 PM	#4 (permalink)
shiloh Cogito ergo doleo Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Culver City, California Posts: 630	Liked it alot. Any show where pretty much everyone gets whumped is fine by me! And a total angst-fest to top it off!! But seriously, yeah, very cool, though I agree Sokhar wasn't intimidating enough for my taste. But Apophis-mon more than makes up for that. Those scenes with Jolinar and Bynarr were too creepy for words. Added an entire new level of horror. Daniel: Your mate, Amaunet, is dead. Sorry to ruin your day. No, actually, I'm wrong about that. I'm not sorry. Jack: Ice tea.... air conditioning ... water.

19th May 2002, 12:06 AM	#5 (permalink)
kelsi Expert Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Sitting in front of my computer, at home, on Chulak. Posts: 1,411	Thread resurection... I think there was good character development, good potential, and hints, they should do dramatic eps like this mroe often!

19th May 2002, 09:23 AM	#6 (permalink)
PTeppic Reetou Diplomatic Corp Join Date: May 2001 Location: North-west UK Posts: 3,086	Just thinking about it now, what makes a really BAD bad-guy? Someone who really intimidates, who has presence, and threat? Know what I mean? For all his pale-faced malevolence, there really wasn't much evil in the character shown for Sokar. Now I know that most of his power comes from the Jaffa, and against his own people from the technology. But to the wised-up humans, he was just another man on the throne who was nothing special. Imagine someone like "Hannibal the Cannibal" getting that level of technological advantage. But, having watched the two with Tony Hopkins, it was perhaps the confinement and promise of escape which gave the most powerful performance. So, what does this mean for SG-1. Perhaps a psychotic (more so!) Goa'uld who is currently imprisoned by the Goa'uld themselves (or Tok'ra). Someone who mightr have important info? Nope - probably just rambling again...

26th May 2002, 08:50 AM	#8 (permalink)
PTeppic Reetou Diplomatic Corp Join Date: May 2001 Location: North-west UK Posts: 3,086	I suppose it can be difficult to build up sufficient tension and history into a character just in the pre-titles, so that they have the background to support the personality by the time we see them?

24th September 2003, 07:01 AM	#10 (permalink)
ReplicatorX Replicating... Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 37	This episode is probably my favourite episode from Season 3 and I would have to disagree about Sokar, I found him to be very sinister and intimidating, he seems like one of them silent evil kinds, where no one really knows what his thinking. I found him to be slightly more evil then Anubis.

24th September 2003, 09:57 AM	#11 (permalink)
jwells Advanced Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Brighton, England Posts: 121	Interesting comment, considering they're both the same actor!

24th September 2003, 12:14 PM	#12 (permalink)
ReplicatorX Replicating... Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 37	Yeah I mentioned Anubis because of that reason and also they both are quite similar characters. Both wear hoods, Anubis is a bit more mysterious than Sokar, I loved how they gave Sokar such pale skin, looked great.

24th September 2003, 06:40 PM	#13 (permalink)
PTeppic Reetou Diplomatic Corp Join Date: May 2001 Location: North-west UK Posts: 3,086	To be honest I found him difficult to take him seriously. He had considerably too little screen time to give over any sort of lounging menace, i.e. sitting back and condemning to death great hordes of supplicants. He also never seemed to show emotion, hate, leading to anger, etc. There was just a bloke in a big hood with lots of troops. So what.