9th Chevron - Page 4 - Science Fiction Fantasy Chronicles: forums

Jedispara · 25th February 2002, 11:02 PM

ok... sorry if i breack the chain of though here....

ok we know that the 8th symbol extends the radius of teh gate system.... but one thing you've forgotten is that it may be designed so that its range is limited to the 39 closest galexies.... so that would mean that you've got this...

x1, x2, y1, y2, z1, z2, and the origin as the base sets for our galexy (each galexy that had there own stargate system would have all of these, only different symbols)

then you have the 8th chevron for the next 39 closest galexies....

so to recap what has been said we have the...
-time theory
-big bang time theory
-multiply universe idea
and...
- the distance theory

so with that i'm going to add one of my own....

consivably for a 9th chevron to work we would need DHD, becasue they can add any amount of power that they want so you would just have to press 9 chevrons instead of 8 or 7. So then if you had that locked in and the gate allowed you to start it up... then concevable it would work... then the fun begins... lets call the 8th and 9th, a and b.... now when you dial a planet you have to have the coridnates of the planet with the factor of a in it.... now a could represent a multiplication of the coridinates of 2. so that increases the consevable distance to 2, and then lets say it could stretch out to the 39 nearest galexies, which would all be in realative the same time era in space.... now because of the big bang. the futher out you look in space, the further back in time, you go. so as you add the 9th chevron you add a time factor.

so as you dial to a coridinate way out there, to conect to it and actually meet anyone you would have to go back in time. so what the 9th glyph allows you to do is to access any point in our universe at the same realative time as your planet. Only this wouldn't require that you go through a sun flare....

now i know that this is only a combitnation of 2 theories but it uses the fundimental laws of the universe and the ime-space relation.

any one confused?

leprykawn · 26th February 2002, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jedispara
the futher out you look in space, the further back in time, you go. . . . . . . .
any one confused?

Yes, I AM confused. When you say "the further out you look in space, the further back in time you go" , what do you mean? I realise that the Hubble telescope, for instance, can "look back in time", as it were, but really what is happening is that the distance from our planet in space to the location in space of a galaxy hundreds of billions of light years away is so vast, that the light leaving that galaxy hundreds of billions of years ago is only now reaching our solar system. In fact, if you were to (somehow) instantaniously transport yourself to that galaxy NOW, the galaxy you were "looking at" would ba A LOT different from the one you were to visit. The image of this galaxy is a relic of hundreds of billions of years, and is nothing like what it is today.
In other words, when you "look out" really far into space, you are NOT looking back in time.

PTeppic · 26th February 2002, 07:28 PM

So, when we look at how something looked millenia ago, now, that is not looking back in time?

leprykawn · 26th February 2002, 07:49 PM

No, we only see the light that left that "something" millenia ago, and that "something" is so far away that even it's light (the fastest known thing in the universe) takes ages to reach us.

Jedispara · 26th February 2002, 10:27 PM

what i was trying to say is that the 9th chevron would take you back in time relative to the number of light years away. so you would go back in time and go further than what the 8th chevron can take you. ok?

BC Rommie :D · 27th February 2002, 10:24 PM

in my oppinion the 9th one is used to go even further away from the asgard galaxy so it will prob be used to add more distance

Jedispara · 27th February 2002, 10:39 PM

but you would have to factor in teh expansion of galexies and the time difference...

shazstar · 1st March 2002, 06:54 AM

Ok, I know that most of my wacky theories kinda fail to relate back to what I believe the 9th chevron does. Thing is, the way I figure it, to theorise what the 9th is capable of we need to use a basic knowledge of physics to support this.

I try to look at the Chevrons of the gate in reference to co-ordinates. Einstein proved that the speed of light was constant and absolute, and so space and time are relative quantities. To define and pinpoint an event, you use three co-ordinates for space, that is, x, y and z. And then a fourth coordinate is used for time, when the event occured. Call this fourth co-ord t. So I try to look at the chevrons representive of these points.
For example, the co-ord found through the first 6 chevrons is equivalent to x. The 7th, the point of origin, is used for y. If the 8th chevron extends gate radius, then that is z, and so.... whats left? The 9th chevron, used to pinpoint when the event occurs.

Now because the number of possibilities of chevron combinations is fixed, this to me indicates a time chart, or something whereby time is charted into that number of possible chevron/glyph sequences.

Also the obvious problem with the x y z and t thing is that obviously, you don't use the ninth chevron all the time, or the 8th, so where does the $dimensional space theory fit in during normal gate travel? I am guessing that within a certain radius, the 6 symbols comprise the original x yand z, while the point of origin is somehow subsituting the time coordinate. But then....now I am off on another train of thought...since there is no time dilation between Earth and the other planets sg1 travel to, then somehow the wormhole substitutes for this fourth coordinate and the space time continuum is void within this frame of reference (this frame of reference being the 7 symbol capacity for the gate).

PTeppic · 1st March 2002, 07:55 AM

The problem with the ninth chevron (compared to most of the other technologies) is that we are pretty much guessing, however we call it!

With the other things we can use what we KNOW (i.e. what has been said on the show) and extrapolate into real-life science. For the ninth chevron, we know a small amount about the eight chevron, but only its result, not its actual effect... just a conclusion, not actually stopping this interesting and fascinating discussion, just sort of saying it will never come to a single conclusion because we don't have enough material yet from the show...

So - let's hope that the tantalising 9th (and 8th) chevronsmake a welcome re-appearence in either the movie or Series 6.

leprykawn · 1st March 2002, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jedispara
but you would have to factor in teh expansion of galexies and the time difference...

I dont know about this -> Sam already worked out a way to negate the expansion of the galaxies (like continental drift, except on a universe-wide scale, and with galaxies instead of continents). Then they could dial Chulak, where they met Tea'lc...

shazstar · 1st March 2002, 02:36 PM

Yeah..somehow Sam managed to factor in a value which simplyfied the equations, most likely by negating a already fixed value.

By cancelling the effects of steller drift and extrapolating new positions (most likely using dimensional space-time as a guide) Sam managed to reintergrate the addresses. And this can obviously be done again...

however I agree with Pteppic all of our conclusions and theories (or at least mine anyway!!) come from info given to us on the show, known theories and our own secondguessing. I too REALLY hope theres more to work with in the sixth season.

I find this kind of thing fun, it really teaches you concepts about not only the idea of a "stargate" but also physics. It certainly incredibly helpful to me to read other perspectives and theories. So thanks guys, Ive learned heaps from this entire forum!

Jedispara · 1st March 2002, 09:55 PM

i wasn't refering to our galexy... i was refering to some of the most distant galexies in the unverse and how to go there and actually find something you would have to travel back in time.... ok?

PTeppic · 1st March 2002, 11:17 PM

Out of interest, how big IS our galaxy, since it was pretty much said in series 1 or 2 that this is the size of the gate network that we know about (maybe in "The Fifth Race")?

Jedispara · 2nd March 2002, 05:36 PM

i can look that up... but also what about other gate networks in different galexies... this would be one huge network!

shazstar · 4th March 2002, 01:12 PM

I did an assessment task for physics last year on Edwin Hubble, and if you look him up online there are HEAPS of addressess and links which refer to his work on the expanding universe. I am fairly sure I remember, one of these give a ~value for the rate of expansion and current size.

25th February 2002, 11:02 PM	#46 (permalink)
Jedispara {IPPH} Trade CO Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,890	ok... sorry if i breack the chain of though here.... ok we know that the 8th symbol extends the radius of teh gate system.... but one thing you've forgotten is that it may be designed so that its range is limited to the 39 closest galexies.... so that would mean that you've got this... x1, x2, y1, y2, z1, z2, and the origin as the base sets for our galexy (each galexy that had there own stargate system would have all of these, only different symbols) then you have the 8th chevron for the next 39 closest galexies.... so to recap what has been said we have the... -time theory -big bang time theory -multiply universe idea and... - the distance theory so with that i'm going to add one of my own.... consivably for a 9th chevron to work we would need DHD, becasue they can add any amount of power that they want so you would just have to press 9 chevrons instead of 8 or 7. So then if you had that locked in and the gate allowed you to start it up... then concevable it would work... then the fun begins... lets call the 8th and 9th, a and b.... now when you dial a planet you have to have the coridnates of the planet with the factor of a in it.... now a could represent a multiplication of the coridinates of 2. so that increases the consevable distance to 2, and then lets say it could stretch out to the 39 nearest galexies, which would all be in realative the same time era in space.... now because of the big bang. the futher out you look in space, the further back in time, you go. so as you add the 9th chevron you add a time factor. so as you dial to a coridinate way out there, to conect to it and actually meet anyone you would have to go back in time. so what the 9th glyph allows you to do is to access any point in our universe at the same realative time as your planet. Only this wouldn't require that you go through a sun flare.... now i know that this is only a combitnation of 2 theories but it uses the fundimental laws of the universe and the ime-space relation. any one confused?

26th February 2002, 07:28 PM	#48 (permalink)
PTeppic Reetou Diplomatic Corp Join Date: May 2001 Location: North-west UK Posts: 3,109	So, when we look at how something looked millenia ago, now, that is not looking back in time?

26th February 2002, 07:49 PM	#49 (permalink)
leprykawn Lord of the Leprechauns Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 98	No, we only see the light that left that "something" millenia ago, and that "something" is so far away that even it's light (the fastest known thing in the universe) takes ages to reach us.

26th February 2002, 10:27 PM	#50 (permalink)
Jedispara {IPPH} Trade CO Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,890	what i was trying to say is that the 9th chevron would take you back in time relative to the number of light years away. so you would go back in time and go further than what the 8th chevron can take you. ok?

27th February 2002, 10:24 PM	#51 (permalink)
BC Rommie :D The Charmed One Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 89	in my oppinion the 9th one is used to go even further away from the asgard galaxy so it will prob be used to add more distance

27th February 2002, 10:39 PM	#52 (permalink)
Jedispara {IPPH} Trade CO Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,890	but you would have to factor in teh expansion of galexies and the time difference...

1st March 2002, 06:54 AM	#53 (permalink)
shazstar Flygirl Join Date: May 2001 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 1,213	Ok, I know that most of my wacky theories kinda fail to relate back to what I believe the 9th chevron does. Thing is, the way I figure it, to theorise what the 9th is capable of we need to use a basic knowledge of physics to support this. I try to look at the Chevrons of the gate in reference to co-ordinates. Einstein proved that the speed of light was constant and absolute, and so space and time are relative quantities. To define and pinpoint an event, you use three co-ordinates for space, that is, x, y and z. And then a fourth coordinate is used for time, when the event occured. Call this fourth co-ord t. So I try to look at the chevrons representive of these points. For example, the co-ord found through the first 6 chevrons is equivalent to x. The 7th, the point of origin, is used for y. If the 8th chevron extends gate radius, then that is z, and so.... whats left? The 9th chevron, used to pinpoint when the event occurs. Now because the number of possibilities of chevron combinations is fixed, this to me indicates a time chart, or something whereby time is charted into that number of possible chevron/glyph sequences. Also the obvious problem with the x y z and t thing is that obviously, you don't use the ninth chevron all the time, or the 8th, so where does the $dimensional space theory fit in during normal gate travel? I am guessing that within a certain radius, the 6 symbols comprise the original x yand z, while the point of origin is somehow subsituting the time coordinate. But then....now I am off on another train of thought...since there is no time dilation between Earth and the other planets sg1 travel to, then somehow the wormhole substitutes for this fourth coordinate and the space time continuum is void within this frame of reference (this frame of reference being the 7 symbol capacity for the gate).

1st March 2002, 07:55 AM	#54 (permalink)
PTeppic Reetou Diplomatic Corp Join Date: May 2001 Location: North-west UK Posts: 3,109	The problem with the ninth chevron (compared to most of the other technologies) is that we are pretty much guessing, however we call it! With the other things we can use what we KNOW (i.e. what has been said on the show) and extrapolate into real-life science. For the ninth chevron, we know a small amount about the eight chevron, but only its result, not its actual effect... just a conclusion, not actually stopping this interesting and fascinating discussion, just sort of saying it will never come to a single conclusion because we don't have enough material yet from the show... So - let's hope that the tantalising 9th (and 8th) chevronsmake a welcome re-appearence in either the movie or Series 6.

1st March 2002, 02:36 PM	#56 (permalink)
shazstar Flygirl Join Date: May 2001 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 1,213	Yeah..somehow Sam managed to factor in a value which simplyfied the equations, most likely by negating a already fixed value. By cancelling the effects of steller drift and extrapolating new positions (most likely using dimensional space-time as a guide) Sam managed to reintergrate the addresses. And this can obviously be done again... however I agree with Pteppic all of our conclusions and theories (or at least mine anyway!!) come from info given to us on the show, known theories and our own secondguessing. I too REALLY hope theres more to work with in the sixth season. I find this kind of thing fun, it really teaches you concepts about not only the idea of a "stargate" but also physics. It certainly incredibly helpful to me to read other perspectives and theories. So thanks guys, Ive learned heaps from this entire forum!

1st March 2002, 09:55 PM	#57 (permalink)
Jedispara {IPPH} Trade CO Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,890	i wasn't refering to our galexy... i was refering to some of the most distant galexies in the unverse and how to go there and actually find something you would have to travel back in time.... ok?

1st March 2002, 11:17 PM	#58 (permalink)
PTeppic Reetou Diplomatic Corp Join Date: May 2001 Location: North-west UK Posts: 3,109	Out of interest, how big IS our galaxy, since it was pretty much said in series 1 or 2 that this is the size of the gate network that we know about (maybe in "The Fifth Race")?

2nd March 2002, 05:36 PM	#59 (permalink)
Jedispara {IPPH} Trade CO Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,890	i can look that up... but also what about other gate networks in different galexies... this would be one huge network!

4th March 2002, 01:12 PM	#60 (permalink)
shazstar Flygirl Join Date: May 2001 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 1,213	I did an assessment task for physics last year on Edwin Hubble, and if you look him up online there are HEAPS of addressess and links which refer to his work on the expanding universe. I am fairly sure I remember, one of these give a ~value for the rate of expansion and current size.