Trying to pick a POD Publisher...HELP!

[Teresa Edgerton]

Originally Posted by I, Brian

For someone who said themselves they were "leery of giving my money to a new startup", you seem to have changed your mind awful quickly.

I noticed that, too. As I also noticed that darrell spends a lot of time extolling the virtues of a company he only knows about through their website. Are we missing some information that would explain this? If so, anyone considering contacting Luna Brillante on the strength of his recommendation might want to know the source of that information.

I hope you haven't fallen a victim to viral marketing, darrell. It's everywhere on the web these days, you know.

[SJAB]

Hmmm.... just looked over the site. Yes it is shiny and bright, but it doesn't list exactly what you get for you money. Or maybe I missed it.

It is on the high side for POD, though. Going from $400 to $900 for the set up.

But each to their own. You pays your money and live with what happens next.

Just POD is a minefield if you are not careful.

[LauraJUnderwood]

A good place to check on all publishers (PoD, Vanity or Otherwise) is Preditors & Editors webpage. They have lists which include notes as to whether said publisher is a wise choice or a bad choice.

OTOH, have you actually tried submitting through regular channels first. PoD is not really the answer to publication. Apart from which PoD is a technology, not a publisher. A number of small presses are using PoD because for short runs, it is cheaper, but for long runs, PoD gets horribly expensive. Some larger houses use PoD just to produce ARC copies to send to reviewers, but large presses still use offset printing to produce mass market and hardcovers and trade editions.

Look at ralan.com if you need a list of available publishers.

Also, beware of such places as PublishAmerica (and its British counterpart) who make promises and keep none of them, and find clever ways to part you from your money.

Yog's Law: Money Flows Towards The Writer. The Only Place A Writer Signs A Check Is On the Back.

Laura J. Underwood
Author of DRAGON'S TONGUE

[pendragonpress]

If you are, dare I say it, desperate to be published, why use a PoD company when you could go direct to a digital printing company?

Yes, it would mean you do all the jobs the PoD company does - typesetting, ISBN registration, etc - but it isn't difficult just labourious, and you'll be learning all the time...

So, in essence: bypass PublishAmerica and it's ilk and go directly to Antony Rowe, Lightning Source or the other small digital printing companies in the UK: you're cutting out the middle-man, and quite probably saving yourself a few quid...

[epicfantasy7]

I have self published two novels. The first I did with IUniverse and I was very happy with the results. They designed my cover and they did it based on my suggestions and recommendations.
The second novel I published with Lulu and I designed the cover myself. I am also very happy with them. This novel just came out and got quickly listed with amazon, bn etc. with cover pic and blurb.
So, both services were good by me.

This new company you are talking about sounds a little peculiar. You say that you will not have to pay for book returns? sounds unusual.

A third company that I like, have talked to them on the phone many times, and may publish with in the future is Xlibris. they send me a nice package of information and materials. You may want to take a look at them.

As far as the whole POD thing. Nobody is going to market your book. You have got to do pretty much everything. So when it comes to that I figure it almost doesn't matter who you go with.

Okay, My advice

Your first book?

GO with lulu, they are cheap and have the whole system running reasonably smooth. And while you are going through this process (It will take at least two months until your book shows up on the onlline retailers) start working on your next book.

[Teresa Edgerton]

Here is the page on POD at the SFFWA (Science Fiction Writers of America) Writer Beware website.

http://www.sfwa.org/Beware/printondemand.html

The information there has been carefully researched.

Anyone planning to use a POD service should check out websites like this one, rather than simply go by what the publisher sends you or the publisher promises you. As I said before, promising something and being able to deliver on it are two different things.

I know I've generally been discouraging about POD publishing, but here is the thing: you need to know what you are getting into before you choose which route you want to pursue, traditional or self-publishing. Nobody (well, nobody that I have ever met or heard of) is going to paint an overly optimistic picture for you about traditional publishing. On the other hand, there are plenty of companies and individuals who have a vested interest in over-selling the advantages of self-publishing.

So, before you make any decision, be sure your expectations are reasonable, and before you put out any money (if that is the way you decide to go) make very sure that the company you are dealing with has a reputation for fulfilling the expectations of their authors.

[LauraJUnderwood]

With places like iUniverse, Xlibris and even Lulu, you do at least know up front what you are going to be charged.

Stay away from 1ST Book and American Publishing. The former cares only for your money; the second insists on a "retainer" fee of nearly $1000, which they claim they will reimburse when you sell X number of books within a limited time period (that is generally impossible to do).

I have personally met the people behind lulu.com and they are very honest about what they are doing. One of their people was on a panel with me, and he strongly insisted that you should take your time with the project before publishing it on Lulu. That they saw too many people just slap their books up without editing or making sure they were really doing it right.

Personally, I am considering Lulu for a reprint collection. I have two novellas that were published with e-book publishers that have in recent months folded. I have the right back on one and am waiting for the other to send the letter (they said September at the latest), and then I will probably look into putting them up on Lulu.

Of course, I could probably sell print rights elsewhere on both too.

We will see.

The bottom line is don't jump in feet first. Like Teresa says, no one is going to tell you that commercial publishing with big houses is a bed of roses.

We WISH it could be a bed of roses, but there are always a few thorns.

Laura J. Underwood
Author of DRAGON'S TONGUE

[Teresa Edgerton]

Thorns, indeed. But what aspect of life doesn't have at least a few of them?

I'm glad to hear that man from lulu made a point of urging authors to polish their work before self-publishing. One reason why the form doesn't have as much credibility as it used to, when it was harder to do (and indicated more care and involvement on the part of the author as compared to sending a book off to a vanity press), is because too many writers rush into print.

(Laura, I see that you figured out how to use your book cover as your avatar. I used mine for several months, until I decided I was tired of looking at it.)

[LauraJUnderwood]

Originally Posted by Teresa Edgerton

Thorns, indeed. But what aspect of life doesn't have at least a few of them?

I'm glad to hear that man from lulu made a point of urging authors to polish their work before self-publishing. One reason why the form doesn't have as much credibility as it used to, when it was harder to do (and indicated more care and involvement on the part of the author as compared to sending a book off to a vanity press), is because too many writers rush into print.

(Laura, I see that you figured out how to use your book cover as your avatar. I used mine for several months, until I decided I was tired of looking at it.)

Life is indeed full of thorns, and the best art a person can learn is to pluck them and go on.

Lulu wants their site to offer professional stuff. Of course, they can't stop the ones who don't listen and still pop stuff up without polishing it. Cafe Press used to do the same sort of thing, but I think it fizzled because a lot of it was unprofessional unedited drivel.

Yeah, I figured that one out early on. Just had to wait for my 15 posts (and of course, I will probably tire of my cover and put up a shot of Glynnanis or some of my own art when I do).

Laura J. Underwood
Author of DRAGON'S TONGUE

[Battleship Of Fools]

Hi Darrell,

I recently used WingSpan Press to publish my novel, “Battleship of Fools.” So far they were professional and honest. The royalties are also good.

Another highly recommended POD publisher is Aventine Press. But they are kind of religion oriented and are hesitant to work with unconventional science fiction.

Best regards,
Igor Gershengorin.

[Robert M. Blevins]

POD of your own book is a tricky business, indeed. Adventure Books of Seattle currently has books printed through Lulu. The Lulu philosophy is simple: Garbage in, Garbage out.

You need an editor to assist with your book before you give POD a try. Also, you should know that if you go with lulu or any other standard POD, you can absolutely FORGET about bookstores or bookstore placement, because you cannot offer the book at a 50-55% discount from retail. The reason is: Because you have to pay too much to obtain each copy.

The absolutely best way to go is where Adventure Books is going this spring:

Lightning Source/Ingram. You can obtain copies of say, a six-by-nine inch paperback of 280 pages for less than $4 USD per copy. That same size book would cost you about ten dollars at lulu. Of course, you will have to pdf your manuscript. You will have to design your cover files.

Don't use those pay-for-service POD's. If you are going to pay someone, pay someone to design the covers and edit the ms. then go to LSI and upload the results. Then...you can approach bookstores by mail or in person and offer them standard discounts. Contrary to what Amazon and Borders may tell you, 90% of books are NOT purchased online, but from bookstores or regular 'department store' type retailers. If you try to sell your book online through a POD, sales will be few indeed. At first, you will be excited to be in print, but let's see how you feel after a year and have only sold 50-60 copies, and many of those to friends or family.

Going through LSI offers certain advantages. You can pay an extra fifty dollars and they will list your new release in the Ingram newsletter that goes to practically every bookstore and library in English-speaking countries. You will get at least some sales from that.

The only reason our little AB press survived Lulu was because we kept page counts reasonable and we were not greedy on retail price. (all books sell for $9.99 USD) Most POD publishers sell their stuff for 12-18 dollars USD. But, we saw it was time to go to the pros...and if you are serious, so will you eventually... And yes...all our titles were professionally edited.

[Robert M. Blevins]

Duplicate. My apologies.

[SpaceShip]

Hi darrell Carrington - glad to welcome you aboard the Chronicles. Like you, I had the same problem and found it almost impossible to find an avenue that would be the one I'd choose. I was given a book called "How to Publish Yourself" (but for the life of me I can't remember who wrote it - I'll try and find out and if I do, I'll post it on this thread) which was extremely helpful and gave me loads of hints on not only how to publish myself but how to go about finding someone to help me. So far as the marketing is concerned, this is the hard bit - it's a slog and you have to promote yourself. Do it confidently and stores/shops will, 9 times out of 10, accept books on sale or return. I've been accepted by Waterstones but I still have to slog around to each individual store. Good luck.

Peter Finch was the author of How to Publish Yourself

[SpaceShip]

By the way, darrell, welcome to the Chronicles.

[Sophia Babai]

Originally Posted by darrell_Carrington

Teresa and Brian, you're right - the only two titles are by the owners of the company themselves.

This is my first post, but I recently entered into contract with Luna Brillante. Thus far I'm pleased. They've given me a press release, a beautiful cover, and a proffessional edior--and while I know this doesn't necessarily mean anything, JC is really nice. It'll be their first book by an author besides the owners, so consider me a guinea pig.