Everyone needs a conspiracy theory....

[Charming Serpent]

I would. :P But, that's just me.

[TK-421]

We learn in the new Jon preview chapter what word is the favourite of the Old Bear's raven.

Anyways, I have a question related to ravens:

If ravens are so smart and used for delivering messages and may even be used for wargging and crows are less smart and are only really good at feasting on corpses, then why is Bran on his way to see the "Three-Eyed Crow" and not the "Three-Eyed Raven". And why is Euron called "Crow's Eye" and not "Raven's Eye". The only explanation I could think of is that a crow has better vision than a raven but I'm just speculating.

[Boaz]

Here's an idea... Okay, I'll confess it's probably the most absurd concept I've posted here... but I'm gonna put it up and see if any of you can find a way to prove it to be true...

Coldhands is actually Lyanna.

Facts: Lyanna was a mess when Eddard found her. There is a tomb for her in the Winterfell crypts.

Assumption: Lyanna died. This is all from Eddard's memory. IIRC, Cat sees Ned's bones, but Ned does not remember brining Lya's bones home... he brought her home.

Facts: Lyanna was willful. Lyanna was a capable fighter. She is assumed to have been the mystery knight at Harrenhal. Benjen Stark, First Ranger, is not a personable fellow to the NW rank and file.

Assumption: Benjen, weakest wolf, survived Robert's Rebellion. What if Benjen got himself killed like Cley Cerwyn did? What if Benjen died from an illness? What if Benjen was poisoned? What if Benjen was killed by Aerys II, but was forgotten?

Now what if Eddard took Lyanna and Jon home to Winterfell? Say... Ben died and was buried in Lya's coffin. Say... Lyanna, a fighter, assumed Benjen's identity and then hightailed it to the Wall so that none of the Stark retainers would recognize her. Say... Lyanna's skills and heritage quickly elevated her to a position of authority in the NW so that none can continually pry into her life. Say... Jon is raised as Ned's bastard, but his mother checks in on him every few years.

Remember the exchange between Benjen and Jon during the feast at Winterfell? Jon said, "You're not my father." To which Benjen replied, "No. More's the pity." If the words are not exact, they're close... Anyway, Benjen's pity was that she is Jon's mother and helpless to guide him. Then she decided to bring him to her... she, Benjen, put the idea of joining the NW in Jon's head.

Eddard never stopped Jon from taking the black. Why? If Jon is Rhaegar's son, then Eddard should have told him! Eddard just let Ben sway Jon and take him away... forever. Why? Eddard did not tell Jon because Jon's mother was already at the Wall and could tell him at her leisure. But Benjen disappeared soon after Jon's arrival...

Benjen is now assumed by some to be Coldhands. Coldhands is black. Lyanna is associated with the blue rose of the North. Mayhaps Coldhands' hands are not black, but dark, dark, dark, dark blue.

Edit: Also the entire Arya is just like Lyanna comparison cannot be ignored. Arya looks like Ned. Arya is willful. Arya is a fighter... will become a very proficient fighter. Lyanna was beautiful, and Arya looks like her. Arya went south and had a major incident in the Riverlands. Both spent time in Harrenhal. Arya joined the NW... mayhaps Lya did too! Both love Eddard and Jon more than anyone else in their family.

[DeannaBelle]

Boaz, that's nuts! But I like nuts.

During my slowly progressing reread, I keep going back to thatexchane between Jon and Benjen, thinking, "What if benjen is Jon's father?" But I never thought of him being his mother... Just maybe that Benjen swang the same way as Jaime.

I do not believe hat a woman fully grown would pass fora man at the wall. ESPECIALLY not a ranger. They would always go off to "make water" alone, and that would be noticed. Not to mention the difference in form. Would we really believe that Roebert would have been so attracted to Lyanna had she the body of Brianne? Hey! Wait, listen "Lyanna," "Brienne." Sound similar, eh? I suppose Lyanna may have run off to the wall to escape beng with Robert. Fun but ... Not possible.


Coldshands being Lyanna may still be possible. Remember the story (I don't remember the storyteller) about the wilding king (?) who picked a rose a Winterfell... Then the lovers hid beneath Winterfell or decades. Thas how I think of Coldhands... hiding beneath the Wall.

[Fourth Hunter]

Boaz you've outdone yourself...by coming dangerously close to my pet conspiracy theory...Benjen equals Jon's father...I know it's weird and only has that one passage to back it up, but...I like it...

[Aegon the Unworthy]

This is the single greatest load of tigger-poop to ever be typed on a page. Seriously I love the thinking, and the audacity of the proposition....but really? The First Ranger was actually the First Rangerette? Seriously....? I swear sometimes your theories are like horrible car accidents Boaz....I want to look away, I know Ill be horrified...but yet Im entranced and must look all the same. Well thanks for the laugh anyhow....

Okay now for the debunking....we'll forgo the usual, men in tight confines...we'll forget that Benjen would have to be measured for armor at some point, we'll forget how quickly Arya was caught as a girl by children much less grown men.....

In Neds chapter there was an earnestness about his recollections of Jon. In fact there was one point where he realized there was something he must absolutely say to Jon....then when offered the Wall he thought...good at least I can be with Jon. At no point did he think that someone else could tell him about Jon, at no point did he thinkI can be with Jon and Lyanna (thats a throwaway because he also didnt think about Benjen), and I really thought it was Catelyn who started the ball rolling on Jon joining the Nights Watch.

Now as for Coldhands....remember the only person who has seen Coldhands and Benjen would be Bran. The only POV we have who would have seen it is Sam. In Sams POV when he wants to tell Jon about Bran he thinks something along the lines of...."How can I tell him his brother is alive and heading north with Coldhands". Clearly Bran never exclaimed "Benjen!" when they got together. Keeping that out of his voice is beyond Bran Im sure.


Really I have more to say, but isnt that enough?

I do love this thread by the way....and thank you for making me laugh yet again Boaz, keep it up.

[Aegon the Unworthy]

I did want to add my most damning piece of debunking which I forgot to put into the original....

The Old Bear at least was a Stark Bannermen old enough to know what Benjen and Lyanna looked like. There were enough people at that one feast alone who could know the difference theres no way Benyanna even risks going.

[Charming Serpent]

Yeah, Boaz ... your funny sometimes :P

[Tysha]

Originally Posted by Boaz

Tysha, very intriguing. But my feeling is that the ravens are just ravens and not CotF. I think the possibility that the CotF have the warging ability and use it to "see" and "act" through the raven as much more likely.
.

That is exactly what I've meant by "eyes".
But Mormont's raven is different, he was there, with Sam, helping him, why? And he came with other ravens, that belonged to Coldhands...
And he always there, saying "kettle" "snow" "die"...
Crows and Ravens are cousins.. So maybe crows are "eyes" as well, and that how the three eyed crow knew about Bran's fall, there were lots of crows in that tower.
TK - yes that interesting point.
There is a secret connection between Black Brothers (crows) and the Children(three eyed crow, ravens, coldhands, secret door that opens only to a BB..)

Originally Posted by Boaz

Coldhands is actually Lyanna..

Wow Boaz, I think it's the craziest idea ever (except maybe the theory about Eddard throwong Ashara from the tower to keep the Jon's mother's identity secret.)
But you know what, if Alleras is Sarella (hate that thing) so why not

Originally Posted by Aegon the Unworthy

I swear sometimes your theories are like horrible car accidents Boaz....I want to look away, I know Ill be horrified...but yet Im entranced and must look all the same..

lol

[viZion]

Who is Sarella?

[MIDNIGHT]

One of the sand snakes that went to Old Town.

[viZion]

Oh, thanks. I've never heard that theory. I guess women pretending to be men is the theme of the week.

[MIDNIGHT]

Well this theory is actually a little more believable than Boaz's latest effort. Tysha posted another theory along with this one a while ago. Its quite good. I'm sure someone could post a link, since I don't know how.

[Boaz]

Originally Posted by viZion

One of the sand snakes that went to Old Town.

Kinda sounds like the start of a limerick...

There once was a Sand Snake, Sarella,
Who went to spy on Tyrell-a.
They called her the Sphinx,
That sly little minx.
They never knew she's a fella.

Originally Posted by viZion

I guess women pretending to be men is the theme of the week.

It's okay, viZ. Your secret's safe with me.

Okay, Research Monkey fetch missing link. The Sarella/Alleras<Alleras=Aegon discussion starts with Tysha's first post on page 11 and continues for the next two or three pages on The Dragon Has Three Heads. This was an awesome discussion last summer.

MID, here's how I post links. First, I find the link and copy the url address, oh something like http://wwww.Boaz'BrilliantIdeas.org, for example (of course the online editor here immediately underlines and colors my fictitious example... which I cannot seem to undo)... I copy the address by highlighting it and holding down Shift+C. Second, I type in the name of the link, oh something to the effect of Tigger's Rock. Third, I highlight Tigger's Rock. Fourth, I select the button just above this text box that says "Insert Link" when I mouse over it. It's the one with the globe in it. Fifth and finally, I paste the address in the bottom line by holding Shift+C. When you open that link box, the link line is already highlighted so you don't have to click on it... just hold down the Shift and C buttons simultaneously. Now you'll notice the words Tigger's Rock will now be in red and underlined. Viola! If a Luddite like me can do it... anyone can.

[MIDNIGHT]

This forum would be a sad sad place without you Boaz. You always manage to make me laugh.