Has Robert Jordan Ever Actually Met A Woman?*

[Niolani]

I agree with everything you've said, Vysey. The whole thing is getting quite laughable, I'm rather upset at myself for being a fan once (although I never liked the portrayal of the women). And yes, I would of liked the Aes Sedai to remain almost omnipotent.

[lightvsdarkness]

I agreed with the most what vysey says, but it's too much of critiques's for me.

So i must ask: "How much differences can be between medieval females, especially from one small village?" I mean, they are already too complex.
And what differences? What womens can be used in story?

[the_faery_queen]

but they're not all from one small village. all jordan's women are fairly interchangable, the asme basic design with different name and likes and dislikes

its hard to explain what makes a character more vivid, but it is certainly more than appearance. i think a way of reacting to issues, certain behavioural patterns, that makes characters seem different. and that's what jordan seems to lack. his women are bossy, patronising, conceited, full of their own self worth. there isn't a lot of variety in those sorts of traits. and women from that village, and women who've been aes sedai for years, and women who are royal (elayne) all seem to act and think the same way. its as though having boobs has made their brains all work the same!

pretty crazy really.

[The_Cosmic_Quest]

His portrayal of women is fairly realistic (if we're talking about american women.)

[the_faery_queen]

how is it realistic? i know plenty of american women who are deeply irratated by jordan's potrayal and who think he doesn't know the first thing about women. sometimg i agree with.

[Shoegaze99]

Has The_Cosmic_Quest Ever Actually Met An American Woman?

[direghost]

My main problem with Jordan is that if everyone would just trust their closest allies and childhood friends and actually TALK this series would have been over in 5 or 6 books.

[The_Cosmic_Quest]

Originally Posted by Shoegaze99

Has The_Cosmic_Quest Ever Actually Met An American Woman?

No.

[The_Cosmic_Quest]

Originally Posted by the_faery_queen

how is it realistic? i know plenty of american women who are deeply irratated by jordan's potrayal and who think he doesn't know the first thing about women. sometimg i agree with.

The reason they are deeply irritated is because he exposes them.

[the_faery_queen]

you just sid you hadn't even met an american woman, so how can you say, with such confidence, that they hate it because it exposes them? sorry, but that's deeply untrue. people often hate something because its an unfair potrayal of them, their gender, their race, not because they see something in it that strikes home and they hate to admit it. sometimes that is the case, but not in this situation. i dislike jordan's women because they are shallow, flat composites, barbie dolls with changable names. there isn't a positive thing about any of them, not one strong, admirable trait. they are all pretty much the same, clothes obsessed, conceited, and arogant. i know many american women, and some are like that, on teh surface, and some aren't. but real people are deeper than jordan's characters, and not all women are the same, the way that jordan's are. to suggest that they are and that they are all the way jordan potrays is offensive, to me at least.

so, please, talk to an american woman, get to know them, meet them, before you decide that all american women are just like jordan's potrayal.

[Green]

I imagine he was just having a light-hearted joke. Or he was trying to wind you up.

[the_faery_queen]

hard to tell and to be honest, people shouldn't really make jokes, or try and wind up, other people they don't know.

[Green]

People shouldn't make jokes?

[the_faery_queen]

not jokes that are sexist or could cause offense, no. and i personally see this, if it is a joke, as rather sexist. here we are saying how badly written the women are in jordan's book, how annoying, and he/she is comparing american women to them and saying its accurate. its bound to cause offense to someone or just irratate peple and i dont think people should make jokes that are going to annoy other people.

especially when they're not partciuarly funny.

[Thadlerian]

I think the point was that people should be careful about making jokes of controversial themes (like gender and ethnicity) to people they don't know (and whose reactions they cannot foresee), especially when the context in which the joke is made is already strained (like the issue of gender prejudice which this thread is about).

Anyway, it's hard for me to say whether TCQ's statement was meant as a joke or not. But as a claim, it's one I've heard many times before. Robert Jordan is supposedly not being biased against women; he's rather exposing their "real selves", showing off some rare insight of the female mind. Some people claim Jordan is a very courageous writer for doing this.

Personally, I fail to see the courage in following a trend. Jordan's female characters are hardly unique. Upon reading Pawn of Prophecy by David Eddings, I recognized many tendencies I'd seen in WoT.

I can't take the idea, that one about Jordan exposing women's true selves, seriously. Comparing the WoT characters with real people I know, and characters in books by female novelists like Doris Lessing, Jordan seems rather out of touch with reality. But, in the end, I'm male, so it's ultimately hard to say for certain.